News:

2box forum: accident-free since the last one.

Main Menu

ATV Hit HAT and Zourman Conversion module issues

Started by Francois D, January 05, 2022, 01:07:05 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

ANGR77

#16
Francoise D, I am still working on it. Sorry for the delay - but the big problem is to find an environment that shows the same kind of issues. It does not show on several tested environments as reported. However, It looks like that we have the same kind of ATV PSU. Maybe we should change your module - to see if the problems remains.

Best regards

Anders / Zourman.com





Sonor Safari, Pearl Crystalbeat, Zourman Triggers, Roland & Triggera, 2box Cymbals & HH, RT-10, KT-10, BT-1, VH-11/12/13, ATV hh, KT-10, 14C/13R/15R, PCY-155, MD, 2Box 5 MK1&II & 3, DD4SE, Pearl ButtKicker Addictive Drums 2.1.14, all ADPaks moved to 2box, Zourman Conversion Gears www.zourman.com

ANGR77

#17
If anybody has problems with my products  - i hope they contact me directly at info@zourman.com and we will work the issues out - just as we do in this post - where we try replicate a more complex scenario with the ATV hi-hat - which has a very special approach to simulate a Roland VH-11/VH-13...with power instead of resistance.

Best regards

Anders / www.Zourman.com
Sonor Safari, Pearl Crystalbeat, Zourman Triggers, Roland & Triggera, 2box Cymbals & HH, RT-10, KT-10, BT-1, VH-11/12/13, ATV hh, KT-10, 14C/13R/15R, PCY-155, MD, 2Box 5 MK1&II & 3, DD4SE, Pearl ButtKicker Addictive Drums 2.1.14, all ADPaks moved to 2box, Zourman Conversion Gears www.zourman.com

Francois D

#18
Hi Anders,

Thank you for the update ! I don't know if changing the module will make a difference since I already send back my first one to drumtec (this is the second unit I have). Let me know if you suceed in recreating the issue.

I'm still investigating it here and I've been thinking that a defect off my motherboard usb controller could be the source of the issue (like a ground shortening somewhere). I'm thinking about this because the issue is still present when the computer is unplugged from the wall (with the focusrite plugged in), but it disapears when the focusrite is disconnected from the computer (and I've tried it whith different USB cables). Also my computer is starting to get old so it seems possible that intense use have damaged it in some ways. I've ordered a small PCI usb controller to test this theory and I'm trying to borrow another computer all together (in case the problem is from the motherboard powering itself). I let you know as soon as I can what the results are.

Best regards

François

ANGR77

#19
Hi best François!

Would you like to try something for me - in your complete environment:

1) Check the figure below - the red cables: Try to stick in a small cable of any size with an open leader connected to the sleeve part of the connector...and drag that cable to the 2box module hi-hat input in the same manner. (The black cables is the ordinary trs cables that you normally use)

The idea is to balance the virtual "Zero" ground between the systems to always be equal and get rid of all type of interferences that seems to going on. As said - we have two systems which shoots power against each other. 2Box are doing it for feeding the hi-hat electronics on the original hi-hat (and in my case - the Zourman module electronics)...and ATV are doing this also because ... I don´t know...(poor design) - as they claim to be complaint with Roland VH-11/VH-13 which only sends resistance. (But this is my thoughts as a designer :-) Anyhow this could definitely lead to problems in certain environments)

2) If this is not improving the situation - You could also add a second cable (which you connect to the first cable system somewhere) and connect that cable to the audio input(s) on the 2box module (in the same manner as above) - which you used as audio input from the computers audio card.

And report back the results, please. 



Best Regards

Anders / Zourman.com
Sonor Safari, Pearl Crystalbeat, Zourman Triggers, Roland & Triggera, 2box Cymbals & HH, RT-10, KT-10, BT-1, VH-11/12/13, ATV hh, KT-10, 14C/13R/15R, PCY-155, MD, 2Box 5 MK1&II & 3, DD4SE, Pearl ButtKicker Addictive Drums 2.1.14, all ADPaks moved to 2box, Zourman Conversion Gears www.zourman.com

Francois D

Hi Anders,

I've tried what you've asked me and the results are the same for all configurations :

Cable from bottom ATV to 2box HH intput : The module is acting like there is no HH controller but the top cymbal is playable (full open hh sound)
Cable from bottom ATV to 2box Audio Line IN : Same results as above
Cable from bottom ATV to 2box HH input and cable from bottom ATV to  box Audio Line IN : Same results as above.

(I've also recieved the USB controller for my motherboard and after installing and connecting the focusrite to it, it does not solve the problem either).

Best regards

François

ANGR77

Hi François.

Good to know - I need to really get this error to show in my environment...but I have a plan!

Just a small question - did you also try to do a new calibration when the patch test cable was in place?
e.g. the hh voltage range will differ completely when the patch cable is installed - so a recalibration is needed.

Best Regards

Anders / Zourman.com
Sonor Safari, Pearl Crystalbeat, Zourman Triggers, Roland & Triggera, 2box Cymbals & HH, RT-10, KT-10, BT-1, VH-11/12/13, ATV hh, KT-10, 14C/13R/15R, PCY-155, MD, 2Box 5 MK1&II & 3, DD4SE, Pearl ButtKicker Addictive Drums 2.1.14, all ADPaks moved to 2box, Zourman Conversion Gears www.zourman.com

Francois D

Hi Anders,

I've tried doing a calibration after the patch and the results are:

Bottom ATV to 2box HH input : Module detects a HH and after calibration the issue is back as if there is no patch.
Bottom ATV to 2box HH input and Bottom ATV to 2box Line IN : Module detects a HH but after calibration, displays a "Rev" notification on the HH calibration page. After multiple tries the "Rev" message is still here and the HH controller is disable.

Best regards

François


ANGR77

Hi François!

That sounds really strange - regarding your results. Anyhow - I will change my environment completely and do some real hard tests measuring the signal with a oscilloscope- and see what's going and see if I can replicate the problem. (I will do this the upcoming weekend)

However - I have another suggestion - I think I read that you also had a DrumIt Three as well? I have another design for the ATV HH (Not official launched) which is uses the universal trigger interface instead (E.g. Rolands hh instead of 2box hh's architecture). This solution will only work on DrumIt Three/Five MKII and not the original 2box module. Would you be interested to test this design instead and see if you get a better result when connection all stuff like the audio and midi in your environment?

Best Regards

Anders / Zourman.com 
Sonor Safari, Pearl Crystalbeat, Zourman Triggers, Roland & Triggera, 2box Cymbals & HH, RT-10, KT-10, BT-1, VH-11/12/13, ATV hh, KT-10, 14C/13R/15R, PCY-155, MD, 2Box 5 MK1&II & 3, DD4SE, Pearl ButtKicker Addictive Drums 2.1.14, all ADPaks moved to 2box, Zourman Conversion Gears www.zourman.com

Francois D

Hi Anders,

Thanks again for your efforts, I hope I'm not causing you to much extra hours...

You've read right, I had a DrumitThree that I've ordered but only to try and see if my module was the origin of the problem, and since the issue was still there with the DrumitThree I've sent it back. So unfortunatelly I don't have a drumitThree anymore...

Best regards

François


ANGR77

Ok. Then I know.

We are going to nail this issue. :-)

Getting back during the weekend.

Best regards

Anders / www.Zourman.com
Sonor Safari, Pearl Crystalbeat, Zourman Triggers, Roland & Triggera, 2box Cymbals & HH, RT-10, KT-10, BT-1, VH-11/12/13, ATV hh, KT-10, 14C/13R/15R, PCY-155, MD, 2Box 5 MK1&II & 3, DD4SE, Pearl ButtKicker Addictive Drums 2.1.14, all ADPaks moved to 2box, Zourman Conversion Gears www.zourman.com

trmeyer

#26
Hi Anders & François, I just registered as I was having troubles with my newly arrived AD H14/Zourman conversion box connected to my Fame Hybrid Pro which is a rebranded DrumIt 3. I am having the same machine gun like triggers when I'm about to close the hihat. In my case I'm having an amp connected and just because of this thread I disconnected et voilà it behaves as it should. The reason will be the same with François' kit: the ground connection from the power cable. Once connected it seams that some amount of current flows via the audio cable to the ground of the 2box, resulting in the strange trigger behaviour.

@François: I don't recommend to do so as it affects the electrical safety of your Focusrite, but I bet the behaviour disappears as soon as you disconnect the ground and operate the Focusrite just with the hot and the neutral leads of the mains cable.

@Anders: I hope you can come up with a better solution than my 'ground-lift'    ;)

Cheers
Thorsten

Francois D

Hi Thorsten,

Welcome to the thread and thanks for sharing your solutions !

Unfortunatly, I can't disconnect the ground connection on my focusrite because it's usb powered and cutting the ground will result in it not beeing detected by the computer. But I've already tried powering my computer whithout a ground connection and it's not working for me.

Cheers

François

ANGR77

But Thorsten found a way to simulator the problem. :-)

So i am on it...!

Best regards

Anders / www.Zourman.com
Sonor Safari, Pearl Crystalbeat, Zourman Triggers, Roland & Triggera, 2box Cymbals & HH, RT-10, KT-10, BT-1, VH-11/12/13, ATV hh, KT-10, 14C/13R/15R, PCY-155, MD, 2Box 5 MK1&II & 3, DD4SE, Pearl ButtKicker Addictive Drums 2.1.14, all ADPaks moved to 2box, Zourman Conversion Gears www.zourman.com

edcito

Why don't you get an edrumin4 and connect the atv hihat to it and send the midi to the 2box? the edrumin has better hihat control and works perfectly for me.