Strange trigger dropouts / latency, especially when playing busy patterns

[Karbonfaiba]

@halftime

All my toms are split on my 2box. Of those split toms, they are usually 2-zones, rimclick / rimshot. I don't think the amount of zones loaded on a kit seems to make a difference imo - as technically I have overloaded my kits with more zones than supported anyway; 4 to 6 zones per tom input.

@ludman

There is definitely something suspect with some VST hihats causing glitching. I have noticed when keeping time with footchicks (specifically, 4 on the floor) and doing patterns around the kit, seems to be the most bothersome for 2box.

It's most obvious for me on my CORE kit hihat which literally has every articulation populated with about 30-99 velocity layers. Only in combination with the bombarding of CC midi from the controller (keeping time) definitely sends it over the top. This is with a VH-11 btw.

I shall experiment by stripping down my CORE hihat in various ways to see if I can find out what exactly seems to be the cause here. It's diminishing returns with 99 layers and 7+7 levels of openness bow and edge anyway but I always knew it was a lolhat when I exported it. Same goes for the ride actually, absurd file sizes from CORE, definitely stresses 2box when I play it. Symptoms like micro-stuttering of about 50ms every 5 seconds if I footsplash and play ride together.

[welshsteve]

I have changed the card as Busa told, the same card he uses. Not fixed the issue. The problem is the hi hat played by foot while doing a simple pattern. May I give up??Very disappointed!

Oh this old complaint. I love the 2box system, but it was this that bugged me about it. How I got round it, I had 2 drumit3 modules. It was a pain, but in the end a blessing in disguise. I doubled my inputs, allowing me to have 2 crashes, a ride, china and splash and hihat on module and 4 toms, kick snare, a couple of a loop/sample triggers and a cross stick on the other, but also doubled my outs. Meaning my sound man was chuffed as I could give him all the pieces into the desk as separates.

But... sure, one module should be enough for a small kit.

[ludman]

oh yes that could be a good and useful way to go...a bit expensive though! I wonder if ther is another simpler way to fix the problem with just one module...anyone at 2box.se could look after that please?thanks

[halftime]

I had one more thought about the glitching issue. I have lately been using only 2box samples just so that I could play without having to worry about the module's performance. However, I now had a chance to try out some VST samples exported by someone else and there was no stuttering at all. Now, there are two clear differences to my previous experiments: 1) the VST samples are only for snare, bass and toms so the cymbal samples are all 2box, and 2) the tom samples have only one sound, so just head, no rim.

My thought is this: if the toms have no rim sample included, would it mean less processing for the module and hence smaller chance of glitching? Also, would splitting the tom inputs have the same effect? Those of you who use VST kits without issues: are you using the rims of your toms (for rim sounds or something else) or are they split to extend your kit? Does the rim make any difference?

Coming back again to the glitching issue. Nothing major to report, but I have made some new observations. I thought before that the rim sounds might have something to do with the glitching, but it turned out not to be the case. I got to try the same samples as before, but with rims included, and they worked fine.

However, there was one major difference in the samples compared to my own exports that I didn't know about: the samples that work fine were not created with SDSE but manually. So, it would seem that there's something about the SDSE-generated files that makes them heavier than manually created files. What it is, I don't know yet. I'll try to see if there's something in SDSE's settings that might explain the difference when I have the chance.

[edcito]

I don't think manually created kits will make any difference, it's been established that the 2box hardware is not capable of handling busy patterns, it's ideal for a beginner learning 4/4 AC/DC songs but once you want to go David Weckl things fall apart...

I've sent my SD3 samples created with SDSE to many experts around here, even to Rik, and they were all baffled since there is nothing wrong with these...

I tried to create a full kit from the Fields of Rock SD3 expansion manually in my mac and studio one but I saw that it would take me a lot of time to do it so I just drop the idea, but again, I don't think SDSE is the problem either.

Even karbonfaifa has admitted now that he has glitches, microglitches but he noticed them so....

Anders is happy with AD2, so he won't go and buy SD3 only to confirm what I've discovered almost 2 years ago with the speedlight kit....

I moved on from 2box, to a Roland TD-50X with digital Pads, triggering SD3 all the time, the most expensive controller I've owned.....

 

[welshsteve]

I don't think manually created kits will make any difference, it's been established that the 2box hardware is not capable of handling busy patterns, it's ideal for a beginner learning 4/4 AC/DC songs but once you want to go David Weckl things fall apart...

I've sent my SD3 samples created with SDSE to many experts around here, even to Rik, and they were all baffled since there is nothing wrong with these...

I tried to create a full kit from the Fields of Rock SD3 expansion manually in my mac and studio one but I saw that it would take me a lot of time to do it so I just drop the idea, but again, I don't think SDSE is the problem either.

Even karbonfaifa has admitted now that he has glitches, microglitches but he noticed them so....

Anders is happy with AD2, so he won't go and buy SD3 only to confirm what I've discovered almost 2 years ago with the speedlight kit....

I moved on from 2box, to a Roland TD-50X with digital Pads, triggering SD3 all the time, the most expensive controller I've owned.....

 

With the exception of the fantastic playability with the digital pads and cymbal, you'd have been better off with an edrumin10 or 2.

But if the digital pad is the attraction (and I can understand why) maybe a TD27? Just seems like a lot of money for, like you say, a controller for SD3

[edcito]

The only reason I don’t get a TD-27 instead is the really stupid Db-25 snake…
I wish there was a new td-12… TD-35 maybe…

[halftime]

I admit that I've occasionally considered changing the module to a Mimic or maybe an EFNOTE 5 to get rid of the performance issues. However, even with the built-in samples, the 2box just sounds better to me than any other module except the Mimic, so I'm not giving it up just yet. I'm still quite content with some of the native kits and they're enough for my home practice and the occasional drum cover video.

[edcito]

With the exception of the fantastic playability with the digital pads and cymbal, you'd have been better off with an edrumin10 or 2.

But if the digital pad is the attraction (and I can understand why) maybe a TD27? Just seems like a lot of money for, like you say, a controller for SD3

What you're using now? a mimic pro no? I heard there is some rumours of pearl releasing something new for the mimic at the next UK drum show in April, will you be attending?

I sold the td-50X and got now 2 edrumins... 1 10 and 1 4, however if pearl comes up next week with something interesting I may consider a mimic...

[welshsteve]

Well, I have a couple of set ups.

Mimic pro is the main gigging gig with a Jobeky Pads/Cymbals but with Drone Halo triggers.

For home use, edrumin10 and edrumin4 into a MacBook Pro with SSD5 ran either in Logic or MainStage.

I HOPE there's a software release to the mimc, while it's awesome already.. would feel a bit let down if they stop supporting it.

I am still a massive 2box fan, and I still hanker to have a Drumit5 MK2 module. Just with owning the above, seems overkill.

[edcito]

Well the UK drum show has finished and there were no announcements from pearl regarding an update for the mimic pro so back to square one on that front... someone mentioned on the vdrums forum that this is now a side project from the slate developer and that he is working on an update but is not being paid for it...so he's doing it more as a hobby and out of good will rather than as a work obligation so....it could take a long time if ever before an update is released... kinda like 2box, which seems to be a hobby more than a real business...

[welshsteve]

If that is the case (he's doing it as a hobby) I am sure mimic users would happily contribute to a go fund me for the guy. I know I would. I know who they're talking about and I have had many conversations with him, he seems like a really cool dude. But, you'd have to publicly ask for that and that brings bad press to it, so I can't see how it could happen even if say, 100 mimic users would happily tip him for his work.

[edcito]

Well not exactly as hobby but on his own free time but still as a Slate Audio employee, it seems he has no budget for developing software updates for the mimic pro, which leads me to think why is Slate doing anyway since SSD5.5 hasn't been updated in years either and their midi maps got stuck on the td-30, no support for TD-50 digital pads, so it seems pearl just takes a cut for each mimic sold but isn't interested in releasing new sounds or anything while Slate has no interest/budget either and are mainly concerned with selling raven consoles and monthly paid software, no love for the 5 edrummers (they think) out there...