cut attack dsnd

[drummologo]

hello guys excuse my broken English, but now we come to the problem, I created some DSND with EZDrummer using cubase for wav ... then load the wav with dsoundtool and create the file DSND with various layers (approximately 40) by clicking on the icon speaker dsoundtool feel that works well ... the problem and now, the DSND load module and then playing with the instrument I realize that the files DSND were cut in the attack of the sample slightly earlier by dsoundtool especially in shots with more volume and dynamics.
some of you have had the same problem?
how can I do to solve it, thanks.

[Jman]

hello guys excuse my broken English, but now we come to the problem, I created some DSND with EZDrummer using cubase for wav ... then load the wav with dsoundtool and create the file DSND with various layers (approximately 40) by clicking on the icon speaker dsoundtool feel that works well ... the problem and now, the DSND load module and then playing with the instrument I realize that the files DSND were cut in the attack of the sample slightly earlier by dsoundtool especially in shots with more volume and dynamics.
some of you have had the same problem?
how can I do to solve it, thanks.

Yeah, cut off tails has been something that has come up building the dsnds manually with DsoundTool in the past. With SDSE that is solved within the program now. But here is another post about this:

I was wondering about these samples that cut out after like 2-3, which i started to recently notice. I'm probably a tad picky, but ever since i noticed the gate closing type sound at the end of the sample being played, it kind of irritating. After finding this out i was checking out ezdrummer 2, and i noticed it was pretty similar. I started wondering if my quad capture gate was on, but i checked it, and it wasn't on. I guess to me if the sample are going to noticeably end when you strike a hit there should be some sort of noise compensation, in the form of a noise floor sound that fills in for the sample when it ends, or maybe you could a reverb to some how fill in at the end of the tail. I suppose i just think the abruptness of the sound end once you do the last hit is irritating.

I built 100's of dsnds manually before using SDSE. I was one of the guys that figured out the steps needed originally to build them. I actually went back and found quite a few of the dsnds I had built previously that had the chopped tails. Since I am now using SDSE I rebuilt those with SDSE and they are good now.

You may want to send Devious123 a PM though and see if he was able to solve the problem. My memory is short, but if I remember right one of the important things is to make sure your volume when building the sample does not clip but keep it as high as you can short of clipping. Secondly be sure the MIDI sequence being used has enough seconds so the entire hit is recorded. J

[Coda]

The cut tails thing was one of the things that pushed me over the edge to buy SDSE, even though I was quite happy to do it manually with just dsoundtool. That is, until I tried to make my own snare with crosstick->Rim velocity switching. Even though it worked I realised with the workload I couldn't make 100s of these, so the virtual wallet had to come out.
Oh, and today I had to ditch a complete kit that I did with SDSE, because ALL samples had been cut to about 1.1 seconds length, regardless what they were. Sometimes you just cannot control everything...

[Lustar]

Coda, was it a BFD kit by any chance? There's an old issue with BFD2, BFD Eco and BFD3, sometimes samples cut early when rendering. If it was BFD a possible solution is to use "load all to RAM" in the BFD preferences.

[drummologo]

thanks for the answers, I think 99% of buy SDSE Lustar because I was recommended by some Italian friends who have 2box drumit, then Lustar and was very helpful in trying to help me.
I wrote this post as now with "google translator" which is helpful but some of the terms "inaccurate", the problem of DSND are not cutting the tail end, but that is beginning in the attack when I hit strong, when I play ghost notes the attack and perfect, loud sound I cut the beginning of the sound ....

[Coda]

Aha, this is something I wanted to ask Lustar about. Every kit I export has instruments with some milliseconds of silence at the beginning of the sample. I have observed as much as 2ms or more - when you add this to the latency of the 2box (or any trigger system), it would be noticable in certain situations. I am going through every instrument and manually removing the silence with dsoundtool. Maybe it's a particular combination of settings on SDSE that's the problem?

Lustar: yeah you're right - old version of BFD2 found online. I'm waiting for a response back from a seller, because I found BFD3 much cheaper than directly at fxpansion.com, I'll probably buy it tomorrow. Thanks for the tip about the memory setting.

[Jman]

Aha, this is something I wanted to ask Lustar about. Every kit I export has instruments with some milliseconds of silence at the beginning of the sample. I have observed as much as 2ms or more - when you add this to the latency of the 2box (or any trigger system), it would be noticable in certain situations. I am going through every instrument and manually removing the silence with dsoundtool. Maybe it's a particular combination of settings on SDSE that's the problem?

There is a setting in SDSE to trim the initial silence, but I will let Lustar explain further. In order to use that you cannot select "Split into multiple files". Unless I am mistaken if you don't select "Split into multiple files" you won't be able to "remove duplicates". For me removing the duplicates is important so the dsnds have the same amount or nearly the same amount of unique hits as the original Vst's hit samples. As a normal procedure I test my dsnds anyway by loading them in DsoundTool .... so I can look at them and listen to them ..... so for me clicking on Edit in DsoundTool and trimming the initial silence and saving them is just a step I take while the dsnd is open in DsoundTool. I think it is important to look at and listen to your samples in DsoundTool after building them. That is the easiest way to see/hear how they've turned out, at least initially before loading them to your module. J

[Coda]

Hmm, well I have none of those options enabled under "Render", I could have saved myself a lot of time by at least selecting Trim Silence. Anyway, I usually audition the dsnds while trimming manually to make sure they sound OK, but I didn't realise how important "Remove Duplicates" is. Well, at least I'm still in learning mode, and I expect to have to build a lot of kits again once I've chosen a VST to buy.

[Jman]

Well, removing duplicates is something that was added to SDSE. Lustar and I discussed several times about getting the dsnds to end up with the amount of unique hits as in the VSTs, and he worked more of his magic. Honestly though, I had built tons of dsnds before SDSE had the remove duplicate hits option and still use a lot of those dsnds. They play fine. I do prefer to build the dsnds with the remove duplicate hits selected since there is now that choice.

[Lustar]

The Trim Silence option in SDSE is only used to remove the silence from the single wav files (silence between hits).
As far as I know the silence displayed in DSoundTool is a not an absolute value, if the threshold was set higher or lower it would display different values. By using trim silence in DSoundtool it will cut a little bit more from the beginning of the samples (2ms for instance).

[tigeir]

Hi
I have run into similar problems as threadstarter drummologo. I just bought BFD3, which I really, really love, and the first kit I exported with SDSE was sounding awesome (Mapleworks kit). Better by far than my SSD4 kits, in my ears. But then I ran into trouble. I did some stupid mistakes that Lustar helped me out of. But then I had allready started to mess with settings. And now I experience the same cutting of the beginning of samples in my 2 box module. It feels like there is no real attack in the samples. They sound great in BFD3, and also, I think, great in Dkit when auditioning the kit. But on the 2 box module itselfes it is as if it is a pillow on top of the sound. I still have the first kit exported from BFD3 to compare, remember, as well other VST to dsnd kits.
I will experiment on, but any tips and trix would be helpful :-)

[Coda]

You could always trash your SDSE settings and start over. SDSE -> Reset.

[tigeir]

I did of course reset both SDSE and BFD3, I upgraded SDSE, Java and the BFD3 core library. And I downgraded from BFD3 beta to the latest full version.
I could be me doing something wrong (most likely ;-) I am all new in this fantastic rewarding game :-)

It is as if I am missing the initial sound of the stick hitting the head of the toms, if you know what I mean? It is like threadstarter describes. The first "milli-punch" before the "aftersound". Just the very, very first part. It feels like I am digging the stick in to the tom heads but with that pillow feel. Is there some kind of clipping or do I miss some mic's when exporting?
What I mean is this:
In BFD3 there is all those different channels for one particular instrument. When hitting the tom there is OH, close mics, amb mics of course. There is also tom resonance in the other tom channels and snare bleed in the snare channel and so on. Are all theese sounds automatically included in the export to dsnd or do I have to route all  signals in to one "master"?

Last option is maby in the 2box module itselfes? Or to slow SCHC? The samples is all fine, but does not play right? Somehow I belive it is my bad, but I am still very happy with my good kits. I am just addicted to new kits right now. Maby it is best to settle with a couple of favorits and just play ;-)

[Lustar]

Hi tigeir, I'm sending you a mail to look into it!

[tigeir]

Lustar fixed me again. All problems were on my side, thanks again for guiding me to a solution :-)