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DIY 2box Cymbals

Started by RockStarGate, February 13, 2012, 10:07:28 PM

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RockStarGate

Over the weekend I made 3 3-zone cymbals for my new 2box module. I put the piezos in the bell and made edge switches and their working very well! My question is about the hihat. Does anyone know if it just requires 1 piezo and no edge switch and is it the bell also? Thanks!

ROB219

The HiHat is basically the same as the crash cymbals from what I can see, it does have an edge switch... without that you'll get no edge triggering on the hats, something I reckon you'll probably want to have.

Manfred


Hi,

yes, the original 2Box hihat is basically a "normal" 2-zone cymbal with a piezo for bow and switch for edge. It just has the additional board for the level-detection integrated.

Regards, Manfred

Manfred


By the way, in this thread i posted the schematic of the original hihat:

http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,897.0.html

So the cymbal itself has 4 wires connected to the board. 2 for piezo and 2 for the edge switch. On the circuit board there is the magnetic hall sensor for the level detection. The last post shows the correct schematic diagram.

Regards, Manfred

RockStarGate

Thanks Rob and Manfred, I guess I just need to know if the piezo is mounted in the bell. Over the weekend I tried a couple of things. I put a small piezo in the bell and it didn't seem to work to well and then I tried a larger one, I think 27mm and mounted on the bow close to the bell. That seems to work better but I'd like to know for sure.
Thanks!

Jman

Quote from: RockStarGate on February 14, 2012, 11:55:57 PM
Thanks Rob and Manfred, I guess I just need to know if the piezo is mounted in the bell. Over the weekend I tried a couple of things. I put a small piezo in the bell and it didn't seem to work to well and then I tried a larger one, I think 27mm and mounted on the bow close to the bell. That seems to work better but I'd like to know for sure.
Thanks!

The HH unlike the other cymbals does not have the Velocity switching thing going on ... with the other cymbals a bell mounted piezo works well because high velocity on the piezo triggers bell sounds, so naturally the hits right on the bell with the piezo in the bell are going to trigger bell sounds more easily. And playing on the bow, further away from the piezo will play more consistently for lower velocity bow play .... Even though the 2Box HH cymbal has the piezo in the bell, it is not really important IMO that it be be placed there .... most standard edrum brand cymbals work well for the 2Box Hi Hat with Manfred's box.
I could tell you where to stick that piezo! :D ;)
http://stealthdrums.com/

edtc

For my DIY ride , i    use  a 10mm piezo located under the bell ,and that works great ...

RockStarGate

Thanks guys for the info. I guess I'm fine with my build then, just have to tweek settings to get it right. :rock:

edtc

Quote from: RockStarGate on February 13, 2012, 10:07:28 PM
Over the weekend I made 3 3-zone cymbals for my new 2box module. I put the piezos in the bell and made edge switches and their working very well!

what kind of system did you use for the edge switch ?

RockStarGate

Quote from: edtc on February 15, 2012, 03:39:33 PM
what kind of system did you use for the edge switch ?

I bought a sheet of .010 tin and cut out the edge switches with a scissors. I attached them with a thin piece of 3M double sided tape on the back back edge. I was soldering the ground to the cymbal but was having poor results with that so I ended up attaching the ground wire to the nut and bolt that holds the project box on. Looks something like this...

edtc

#10
Quote from: RockStarGate on February 16, 2012, 12:25:33 AM
I bought a sheet of .010 tin and cut out the edge switches with a scissors. I attached them with a thin piece of 3M double sided tape on the back back edge. I was soldering the ground to the cymbal but was having poor results with that so I ended up attaching the ground wire to the nut and bolt that holds the project box on. Looks something like this...

Hi

seeing the picture , i understand why you spoke about weak triggering .... IMO the DST foam you use to stick the piezo absorbs too much  signal ....

I told you i have good results with a small piezo , but i use thin DST ... that s maybe why

Some could tell that it can be fixed by simply increasing the gain , but this will also increase false triggering issues, especially on loud stages , as the piezo could pick up more ambient sounds !

so the hoter the signal is , the safer the triggering will be ...   


By the way , thanks for the pic :) ....   do your switch work for edge zone , or just as a choke ?

RockStarGate

Quote from: edtc on February 16, 2012, 12:57:00 AM
Hi

seeing the picture , i understand why you spoke about weak triggering .... IMO the DST foam you use to stick the piezo absorbs too much  signal ....

I told you i have good results with a small piezo , but i use thin DST ... that s maybe why

Some could tell that it can be fixed by simply increasing the gain , but this will also increase false triggering issues, especially on loud stages , as the piezo could pick up more ambient sounds !

so the hoter the signal is , the safer the triggering will be ...   


By the way , thanks for the pic :) ....   do your switch work for edge zone , or just as a choke ?

When I was building them I was searching posts for ideas and saw that Rob219 used 2 layers of double sided tape and said he had good results so that's what I tried. I'm going to try just 1 layer and see how that goes.
I'm getting zones 1,4,8 and 9 so I guess the switch is working.

ROB219

I did use 2 layers, but here is where I noticed the flaw in your install... the tape you used covers the complete base of your piezo.... that is where the issue lies!

You need to make sure that the taped area is no bigger than the area of crystal on the piezo.

So, if the piezo has a total diameter of 27mm, and the crystal part is 22mm... well that is what size you make the tape disk to mount it. There must be a free area around the outside to vibrate, that is where you get the sensitivity from.

Try that and see how it goes.

RockStarGate

Quote from: ROB219 on February 21, 2012, 01:15:00 AM
I did use 2 layers, but here is where I noticed the flaw in your install... the tape you used covers the complete base of your piezo.... that is where the issue lies!

You need to make sure that the taped area is no bigger than the area of crystal on the piezo.

So, if the piezo has a total diameter of 27mm, and the crystal part is 22mm... well that is what size you make the tape disk to mount it. There must be a free area around the outside to vibrate, that is where you get the sensitivity from.

Try that and see how it goes.

Thanks Rob.....I took apart a CY-8 I had lying around to check the size of the piezo and noticed that Rolands were like that but didn't pay it much attention to it. Goint to re-mount my piezos tomorrow.  I guess I should have realized that when I built my drums using the Quartz cones, his tape only covered the ceramic also.

fulrmr

#14
being new to the 2Box and choke switches...how exactly is the switch wired? I see one wire from the tin to inside the box. What is it attached to?..and then you mention the ground....what is it wired to besides the bolt on the box?

Thanks. :)
Daniel