unofficial 2box forum

other drumming & musical stuff => e-drum DIY / modifications => Topic started by: Manfred on August 14, 2011, 04:13:29 PM

Title: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 14, 2011, 04:13:29 PM
Hello,

yesterday i completed assembly of my hihat adapter which i developed to use cymbals of other brands as a hihat at the 2Box. This is how it looks:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/kHihatAdapter.jpg)

It has 2 connectors. One to connect it to the brain and the other to connect a cymbal. Up to now i tried it with a Roland CY-5 but most other 2 zone cymbals should work. With the CY-5 it works quite good! Important is just that it has a piezo for the bow and a switch for the edge.

It is based on the schematic of the original 2Box hihat which i posted in the other hihat thread. The only disadvantage i found up to now is the price. Making printed circuit boards in small quantities is expensive.

Anyway, more info will follow the next days and maybe also a video of a 2Box with a Roland CY-5 hihat  :D

Regards, Manfred


Edit 10.09.2011:

Video Roland CY-5:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mRekNSxh5c (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mRekNSxh5c)

Video Yamaha PCY-155:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1zYmUzp1eY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1zYmUzp1eY)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on August 14, 2011, 05:03:23 PM
that is great news mate
we look forward to more pictures, videos, and a how to put this gadget in a cy-5!!!
thanx so much for you effort patience and everything yopu do for the community
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on August 14, 2011, 07:19:37 PM
yes Manfred , thanx and congrats!
2box forum is a great community , and you re one of the coolest dude around ....

Can you explain what you use to controle the open/close of the hihat  ? i didnt get if it will be with the sensor device or an external pedal ?

i m looking forward to see the video...

 :patbat2box:

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on August 14, 2011, 08:28:54 PM
Hi Manfred... a very neat and tidy solution for sure! I think you would find that you could get these circuit boards made in batches... and we could buy in groups to assist with the cost. I know I would take at least 5 to kick off with. This makes the whole thing VERY easy, and of course saves people having to buy the entire hi hat just for the hall circuit, like JMan (and I) did!

Are you able to give us a ballpark figure of what these might end up being worth?

Awesome job mate!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 14, 2011, 08:51:12 PM
Hi,

it is very close to the original 2Box level detection which means it uses a magnetic sensor. The tiny chip that you can see on top left of the bottom layer is the sensor.

I plan to put the circuit board underneath the pedal of the hihat and stick a magnet to the pedal. Tomorrow or tuesday i can take some pictures of my test set-up. But its similar like Jman has shown with the original 2Box sensor in the thread about his stealth hihat.

The reason why i started this project is that i want to have a larger hihat than 12". And to have free choice which cymbal to use i decided to separate the level detection from the cymbal. To keep the cost in a somehow reasonable range i ordered a few more circuit boards. So if someone is interested in a board for his own DIY project you can drop me a PM. But at first i want to test it more detailed.

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on August 14, 2011, 09:45:31 PM
hi Manfred ...

Do you think it s possible to put such a circuit board and magnet inside a YAMAHA HH65 or similar HIHAT pedal ? I d prefere  to avoid the use of a HIHAT stand ...




Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on August 14, 2011, 11:25:52 PM
PM'd you Manfred :)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: signature on August 15, 2011, 10:18:50 AM
wow that is awesome!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on August 15, 2011, 01:36:44 PM
Good job Manfred, and you fit 2 jacks on the board, eliminating the need for the splitter ..... cool! 8) J Pm Sent.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 15, 2011, 06:11:11 PM

Hello,

for those of you who are interested in one of the boards. Please give me a few more days for testing. Up to now i tested it only for a short time with a more or less wobbly test setup. Right now i'm preparing a more steady test setup to see whether it is reliable. I want to be sure that it really works good.

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 15, 2011, 09:24:59 PM
Hi again,

just want to let you know the progress i did today. This is what i meant with "wobbly test setup" that i had at first  ;D

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/kErsterVersuch.jpg)

And here is the second test with a much more steady setup. I bought a small box today to put in the board:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/kZweiterVersuch.jpg)

At both pictures you can see the board below the pedal and a magnet right at the pedal. This is how it looks inside the box:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/kBox.jpg)

The level detection works quite good so far. The only difference i noticed is that foot splash sounds are not as loud as with the original hihat. I hope to have time to find out why tomorrow. My guess is that it is related to the position of the piezo at the cymbal. The 2Box cymbal has the piezo near the center while the CY-5 has it in the middle of the bow area as far as i know.

Regards, Manfred

Edit: By the way, all the tests were done with OS1.10 up to now.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on August 15, 2011, 10:37:52 PM
Great work Manfred :) I know you've got at least two of us in Aus wanting one! Please let us know when you're ready to roll them out :animal:
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 16, 2011, 11:13:54 PM

Hi,

some small progress today again. The reason why foot splashes have had a lower volume is simply that zone 3 does not trigger as much as with the original cymbal. With the original hihat i have almost always zone 9 and 3 triggered when stepping on the pedal. With the CY-5 the zone 3 triggers have been much lower or haven't even been there. But all these things can be adjusted by playing with gain and volume parameters in the module and the poti on the board.

In addition the force of the magnet and the distance between magnet and sensor have also an impact on the "playing feeling". A lot of parameters to adjust but hey, its a DIY project  :D

Besides the CY-5 i also tried two other cymbals today. The first was a regular 14" 2Box cymbal (actually my ride cymbal). It works also but is too heavy for the hihat stand. The second one was a cheap single zone Millenium MPS-200. That works also but with only one zone of course (no differentiation between bow and edge). Regarding the "playing feeling" both are not acceptable as a hihat but i just wanted to see if it works with other cymbals.

Next step is to update the OS and see what the new hihat parameters on page HPED can be used for. The description sounds interesting.

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on August 17, 2011, 12:30:02 AM
Looking forward to these Manfred! Can you explain what the jumper switches are for?

Cheers,

Ian
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on August 17, 2011, 06:20:32 AM
Looking forward to these Manfred! Can you explain what the jumper switches are for?

Cheers,

Ian

Jumpers to bypass the trim pot if desired... trim pot is nice though as different cymbals are hotter, or colder ... so that gives a little more compatibility...
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 17, 2011, 10:39:14 AM

Hi,

yes, as Jman already said with the jumpers the poti can be enabled or disabled.

JP1 - Poti enabled
JP2 - Poti disabled

At least my 2Box module seems to have quiet sensitive inputs. Even though i'm not a hard hitter i have "gain" of most inputs (kick, snare, all toms) set to 0. And at snare and one tom this is still too high. Thats why i decided to put in the poti just in case the cymbal is too "hot".

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on August 18, 2011, 03:15:07 PM
hello

you said that foot tchick are difficult to have....

    Does it mean that to trigger the tchick , the module needs the pedal down info and also a little signal from the cymbal piezo ? 

   I ask this because i plan not to use a regular hh stand to hold the HH pad , so in this case there s no way to have a signal from the piezo when pressing the hh pedal . 

Im i right ..?



Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 18, 2011, 04:31:20 PM
Hi,

that was just a matter of settings that i had in the beginning but by playing with gain and volume parameters in the module and the poti on the board i could get quiet good results.

And with the new OS 1.20 it is no problem at all. With parameters SENS and CURVE on page HPED i could easily make good settings for playing foot splashes/chicks.

There is also no signal from the piezo required. This happens more or less by accident with the original hihat and i guess most people don't want it. It happens also with a CY-5 but less marked. I even disconnected the cymbal from my board and it is still no problem to play foot splashes. Thats why i know that there is no signal from piezo required.

It should be no problem to use it without a regular hihat stand as long as you use a proper cymbal with piezo and switch. What kind of cymbal do you plan to use?

Regards, Manfred

Btw. you could also remove the circuit board from the original hihat and put it in your pedal as Jman did. These are just  4 wires (2 x piezo, 2 x switch) that you have to detach and rewire.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on August 18, 2011, 04:51:26 PM
hi Manfred ...

those are good news for me !

I plan to use a mono Yamaha rubber pad for the moment , and will soon make a DIY mini HH from a splash i ve got , in order to have BOW/EDGE sound ... or maybe something smaller with a piece of metal and some rubber ...  dont know yet ! 
I plan to put your board into a E-HH controller or under a modified bassdrum pedal ... i ll see what s best ...

As i use regular hihat on my kit i want something small and easy to fit .... but maybe , thanks to your work , i gonna switch to E-hihat completely ...:)  Im looking forward to try it ...

i ll send you a PM soon







Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on August 24, 2011, 02:28:38 PM
.... Just got my little board today !

I just have a loudspeaker magnet around , but it s enough for some quick testing ... And it seems to work fine ...

Now i have to find the right magnet and the best way to mount it in a pedal ...

thanx for your work Manfred ;)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 24, 2011, 02:35:47 PM

Hi edtc,

you're welcome! Hope to see some pictures of your pedal as soon as you have the more or less final setup  :D

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on August 26, 2011, 07:23:20 PM
So here are some news about the HIHAT board....

I bought a cheap and simple magnet in a tool shop , it is not very strong ,  it is  the only one i found .... but fortunatly it works OK , giving 2 or 3 cm from close to open with a nice curve ...

After mounting the board in a plastic protection box , i taped it under an old mapex bass drum pedal
and taped the magnet under the pedal plate ... i used my DIY ride cymbal for the tests:

         Calibration was easy and as expected ...   :rock:
         zone recognition was ok  :rock:
         Foot chick and splash ok too  :rock:


   Only problem came from the fact my old pedal plate moves a bit from left to right , causing the magnet to move from the calibration sweet spot ....

Also i ll have to get used with the feeling of a hihat controller , previously i only played with a real hihat ... but i think it would be  the same with the regular 2BOX hihat ...



    Once again i say really nice work Manfred !!!!.... "Spitzeklasse" as you say in your country ..." la classe ", comme on dit chez moi !!



Here is a pic , i will post more when i ll have something more definitive ....

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/664080hhpedal1.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=664080hhpedal1.jpg)



Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: espen on August 31, 2011, 03:17:09 PM
Ok. Here's my thoughts so far:

I got the board from Manfred yesterday, thank you very much. It is very well made and clean.
I bought a very strong circular magnet (diameter 20 mm) and a plastic box for the board. Everything relating the board and the magnet worked flawlessy. I could make calibration, foot chicks and splashes easily and the transition between stages (I have five intermediate stages) is great. I only can say it's the best working hh controller I ever had!

The only problem was my hihat pad, Yamaha PCY-135. First, it triggered zone 9 from the edge when hihat was closed. It only fired zone 8 when fully open. Zone 4 (bow) was correct all the time. I opened the cover and it was found out that when removing another edge switch ribbon cable (the upper one in the picture) from the circuit board the problem was half solved. After that, only zone 4 triggered from both bow and edge. I think I can live with that because I like the Yamaha cymbal pads very much but if someone know a fairly easy diy solution for that I would be interested to test. I know something must be done for the circuit board of the pad but don't know what. I also tested it with Roland CY-15 and it the both zones worked.

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f34/Viperguy69/DIY%20Drums/PCY135%20Mod/PCY-135CircuitBoard.jpg)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on August 31, 2011, 09:06:35 PM
Hi espen,

am i right to say that your setup works with all zones with the Roland cymbal or for example a regular 14" 2Box cymbal (not the 2Box hihat but one of the other cymbals)? I'm just asking because i would like to know that the setup with board and magnet is ok. If that is the case we can go on to trace the problem at the Yamaha-Cymbal.

What you definitely need for the 2Box hihat is a cymbal with piezo wired to tip and an edge switch wired to the ring contact as shown in my description. I don't have a Yamaha cymbal but i found the following circuit diagram in the Vdrums forum:

(http://vdrums.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=3019&d=1139433650)

I don't know if that is correct and fits also to your PCY-135. But i guess it should be similar. What you can see is that Yamaha uses 2 switches, one for bell and one for edge. But the edge switch has a series resistor with 10kOhm. This resistor could cause the problem because the 2Box module measures the current through the ring contact for the level detection and also for differentiation between bow and edge. With the 10kOhm resistor in series the currents are not as expected by the module. To confirm my assumption i would do the following tests:

1. Put cymbal back to original state (all plugs back to original position).

2. Test if you can get an edge sound by playing the bell of the Yamaha cymbal (according to the schematic this switch does NOT have a series resistor). If yes, we are on the right way.

3. Do you have a multimeter? If yes could you please measure the resistance as followed:

- Unplug the cymbal from the module
- Connect multimeter between sleeve and ring of the TRS-Jack
- measure resistance with pressed edge switch (press it with your fingers as you would choke the cymbal)
- measure resistance with pressed bell switch (press the bell with your fingers)
- measure resistance with both switches unpressed

Maybe you just have to bypass that resistor and it works. But before modifying anything at the cymbal i recommend to do these test at first. Unfortunately i don't have a Yamaha cymbal but i'm thinking about buying one.

Regards, Manfred

Edit: Does anybody have the circuit diagram of Yamaha PCY-135 and/or PCY-155? This would help a lot to find the problem!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 01, 2011, 12:08:33 AM


(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/664080hhpedal1.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=664080hhpedal1.jpg)
because the pic shows the box to be 2 big (perhaps it is the zoom), i would like to ask something
can this be put under a  pearl eliminator hi hat pedal? from your experience? is it small enough?thanx
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on September 01, 2011, 01:11:40 AM
[quote author=BURNIN AMBITION
because the pic shows the box to be 2 big (perhaps it is the zoom), i would like to ask something
can this be put under a  pearl eliminator hi hat pedal? from your experience? is it small enough?thanx
[/quote]

hi BA

the box is 3cm high ... i think it will fit any hi hat pedal....

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on September 01, 2011, 05:27:39 AM
Ok ... got my boards today. The choices of project boxes is a little different here in the US. After a lot of searching I had 5 different boxes on hand when my boards arrived. Turned out, as I suspected 4 of them were too small. The one I used is a little longer than the gray box you guys have used, but fortunately it fits just perfect for my DW 3500T Hi Hat stand. I used velcro on the box and stand base. The base plate is ribbed, and that is the case with many HH stand bases. I thought about filling in the depressions between the ribs, but thought ... hey, first I'll go with the velcro and see how it works .... Turns out it holds quite well. After a little while of playing with it attached I decided to pull it out to test the second one I built ... and it took a pretty concentrated effort just to pull the box loose from the velcro hooks on the plate.
(http://weblogimages.com/dajmando/HH%20box%20and%20HH%20base%20with%20velcro.jpg)
(http://weblogimages.com/dajmando/Pot%20adjust%20hole.jpg)
(http://weblogimages.com/dajmando/HH%20Box%20attached%20to%20stand%20magnet%20on%20pedal.jpg)
(http://weblogimages.com/dajmando/HH%20Box%20cables%20attached.jpg)
(http://weblogimages.com/dajmando/New%20HH%20box%20with%20dual%20zone%20Meinl%20HH%20set.jpg)
So, everything is working as expected. I have used this to replace my other box I built from a 2Box HH pcb .. Good job Manfred.
I also cranked up the resistance a little via the pot .... very nice feature ... My own HH cymbal was working well at a sensitivity setting of 0 ... now I have some headroom. I have the sensitivity set at 5 now and it is just right.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: espen on September 01, 2011, 08:41:50 AM
Edit: Does anybody have the circuit diagram of Yamaha PCY-135 and/or PCY-155? This would help a lot to find the problem!

I didn't find the actual schematic but I found a picture and the following statement from Vdrums.com relating the difference between PCY-150 and PCY-155 (same circuit as in PCY-135):

"It's almost the same. Three small differences:

1. The layout has been redone, but the basic circuit logic is the same
2. There is a second film switch for the edge, serial to the first
3. The .1 uF capacitor has been replaced by a resistor 51kO"

(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f34/Viperguy69/DIY%20Drums/PCY135%20Mod/SolderPoints.jpg)

If I understand correctly, bypassing of the resistor will work?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 01, 2011, 08:51:37 AM
[quote author=BURNIN AMBITION
because the pic shows the box to be 2 big (perhaps it is the zoom), i would like to ask something
can this be put under a  pearl eliminator hi hat pedal? from your experience? is it small enough?thanx


hi BA

the box is 3cm high ... i think it will fit any hi hat pedal....
great to know, thanx so much
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on September 01, 2011, 10:46:07 AM

Hi espen,

did you try if you get edge sounds by playing the bell? If the schematic is correct this should work because this bell switch doesn't have a series resistor.

And again the question if everything works with an other cymbal? Just want to confirm that your setup with magnet and board is okay. I'm asking because distance between magnet and board and also orientation of the magnet matter.

If the answer to both questions is "yes" it could help to bypass the series resistor to get a good differentiation between bow and edge.

Regards, Manfred


Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: espen on September 01, 2011, 03:36:41 PM
UPDATE:
Yes! I removed the resistor and replaced it with a piece of conductor wire. Both zones now work like a dream. Thank you very much for your help Manfred. This was very easy modification indeed!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on September 01, 2011, 04:05:44 PM

@espen

Nice to hear that your setup with a Yamaha cymbal works with this little mod!

@Jman

Cool, the black box seems to fit perfectly in your hihat. And a black box is a bit more "stealth" than the light grey of my box  :D


In summary we have now the following cymbals working as a 2Box hihat together with the circuit board:

- Roland CY-5
- DIY-Cymbal (made by Jman)
- DIY-Cymbal (made by edtc)
- Yamaha PCY-135 (easy mod required for zone detection)

Thats really cool and i hope this list can be expanded more and more. Maybe with some news from Australia?

Regards, Manfred


Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on September 01, 2011, 07:29:49 PM
@espen



In summary we have now the following cymbals working as a 2Box hihat together with the circuit board:

- Roland CY-5
- DIY-Cymbal (made by Jman)
- DIY-Cymbal (made by edtc)
- Yamaha PCY-135 (easy mod required for zone detection)



... it also works with a simple mono rubber pad... but without edge zone    
naturally ....

By the way , its good to know that Yamaha cymbals are working 100% with this little mod ... and if it works with the HI HAT ,    I imagine that we can get a full 3 zone with a cymbal ... :rock:

Good point because Yamaha rubber cymbals are really well  made , sturdy and thet do sound quiet compared to other products ... I have 2 mono triangular PCY65 and i love them for crash .
.. you can even trigger the bell with them as their piezo is located really close to the bell ... and with an aquarian spring Cymbal holder , they swing and make even less noise ....

I know they exist with an edge switch , and i think those would make a lovely HI-Hat trigger with your board ...


Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: espen on September 02, 2011, 05:48:09 AM
Yes, the Yamaha cymbal pads are very identical in triggering- and acoustic noise -wise to Roland ones except almost half priced! I like them very much. I haven't tried those Yamaha's "pizza slice" pads but I think they don't look visually too attractive, IMO.
My crashes are Yamaha PCY-155 and bow, edge and choke work right but the bell is triggering an edge sample (as Manfred assumed). Also, when I tested my mod hihat pad in one cymbal input the performance was similar. Nevertheless, it's totally adequate for me. I don't need bells of crashes. I have a Roland CY-15 as a ride pad and separation between bell and bow is not as good as I liked. Either the bell is a bit insensitive or when increasing the gain you get unwanted bell sounds from bow when hit harder. But I think this is an issue that is mentioned several times here already and is more problem of the module not the pad itself.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: digitalDrummer on September 02, 2011, 11:20:20 AM


(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/kHihatAdapter.jpg)


Hi Manfred. Which connection is "in" and which is "out"?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on September 02, 2011, 11:35:50 AM

Hi,

there are labels at the circuit board next to both connectors. One is "Brain" and the other one "Cymbal". At the picture the upper connector is for the cymbal and the lower for the module.

Regards, Manfred

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: digitalDrummer on September 03, 2011, 03:44:35 AM
Hi Manfred,
I never expected the labeling to be ON the board - your professionalism is fantastic.
For anyone interested, the box is fully compatible with a Roland VH-12 - just connect the HH out the to box and the box out to your module. My only issue is to find a magnet that works. At first I got no response, then I realised my magnet is too strong. So now I have to find a weaker one. And that's no easy task if you don't know what the magnet rating systems mean!
Again, Manfred, great work. Thanks.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on September 03, 2011, 04:11:45 AM
Hi Manfred,
I never expected the labeling to be ON the board - your professionalism is fantastic.
For anyone interested, the box is fully compatible with a Roland VH-12 - just connect the HH out the to box and the box out to your module. My only issue is to find a magnet that works. At first I got no response, then I realised my magnet is too strong. So now I have to find a weaker one. And that's no easy task if you don't know what the magnet rating systems mean!
Again, Manfred, great work. Thanks.
Allan, did you try calibrating? Also try reversing the magnet... When I setup my box, I got no change from open to closed until I calibrated. And the direction the magnet faces matters, 50/50 chance ... one way or the other...
The reason I mention that is I have a really powerful magnet ....extremely hard to pull two of these apart:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/4-Neodymium-Ring-Magnets-3-4-x-1-4-x-3-8-Rare-Earth-N42-/190567839039?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c5eba753f
It works really well. I set it up so the pedal/magnet is about 1/2" above the top of the box when pedal is fully depressed/closed HH. Also, the hall sensor should be facing the magnet, the jack side of the board should be on the bottom and the Green side up ... Like Manfred's how he mounted his board...
Just throwing out ideas .... J
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on September 08, 2011, 01:21:49 AM
Just received the hi hat controller today... thanks Manfred.

Haven't had a chance to test it yet, but it sure as hell looks the part. This job is unbelievably professional! Well done, + + + + + + :D

Handing out another 3 x Animal  award...

 :animal: :animal: :animal:

I will run it up over the weekend and see how it goes.

Thanks man!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on September 08, 2011, 09:05:20 PM

Hi,

today i made two videos and uploaded them to Youtube. The first one is with a Roland CY-5 as hihat and the second one is with a Yamaha PCY-155. With the Yamaha cymbal i just made a quick setup of the trigger parameters. So not really optimal. The Yamaha cymbal needs a little mod to use it as hihat.

Here are the links:

Roland CY-5:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mRekNSxh5c (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mRekNSxh5c)

Yamaha PCY-155:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1zYmUzp1eY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1zYmUzp1eY)

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 08, 2011, 11:08:31 PM
blown aWAY. WIL GET MINE SOON MATE. WILL PM YOU SOON
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on September 09, 2011, 01:51:06 PM

@twisted.mellow

Thanks for the award ;D I hope it works as expected!


@BURNIN AMBITION

To answer your question at Youtube: I used a 2Box factory sound. Not sure if it was already in the module or downloaded from 2box.se. But it is definitely from 2Box and the name is the "Swiss SE 14 Hihat". Shouldn't be a problem to get the same sound with the 2Box pad. My board doesn't change anything at the sound. I will answer you PM later.

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 09, 2011, 02:12:48 PM
thanx mate. after seeing it in the video i am blown away. i cant describe in english waht i really want, but bootomline is if i play push pull or reverse push pull(especially the later) i hate seeing the center of the 2box hihat moving. i fear for it. with cy-5 that wont be an issue so i need this whole thing!!!!cheers
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Funkstation777 on September 17, 2011, 04:38:21 PM
Thanx again, Manfred,

as already mailed, your board is working perfectly. After putting it into a tiny black box from conrad and putting a strong magnet under the hihat pedal surface, it took about 5 minutes to get the hihat calibrated and started by using a Roland CY-8 (I know the CY-5 is your fave, but it wasn't available at the moment)
So IMO with your tool - you can use almost ALL trigger-cymbals as a hihat.

Thanx again,
Andy from Red Bull Country
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 23, 2011, 01:42:48 PM
so perhaps i could use a cy-8 rathen than a 5?
 the 5 is 10 inches if i remeber well? the cy-8 hw many inches is it?
compared to the original 2box hi hat, cy-5 is smaller, but cy-8 is it bigger?

any reccomendations? what you guys think i should buy?
and also in the cy-8 package when you buy it, oes it have all the nuts etc you need it to use it as a hi hat?
cy-5 in its package has both nuts for use as a hi hat and as a cymbal. same thing happens for cy-8?
thanx
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: roel on September 23, 2011, 05:25:28 PM
so perhaps i could use a cy-8 rathen than a 5?
 the 5 is 10 inches if i remeber well? the cy-8 hw many inches is it?
compared to the original 2box hi hat, cy-5 is smaller, but cy-8 is it bigger?

any reccomendations? what you guys think i should buy?
and also in the cy-8 package when you buy it, oes it have all the nuts etc you need it to use it as a hi hat?
cy-5 in its package has both nuts for use as a hi hat and as a cymbal. same thing happens for cy-8?
thanx

the cy5 has a 10 inch playing surface and the cy8 12 inch.its up to you.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 23, 2011, 10:31:35 PM
ok thanx for it. if cy-8 plays as good as cy5 in 2box, i might stick with cy8.anyone knows how many inches original 2box hihat is?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on September 23, 2011, 10:43:43 PM
I think it s a 12 inch
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 24, 2011, 07:42:18 AM
thanx mate
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: roel on September 24, 2011, 07:46:03 AM
yes 2box hihat is 12inch. ;)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 24, 2011, 12:42:09 PM
one question. i noticed that cy8 is 2 zone ike cy5
but it also has choke capabilities. does this mean it may not work as well as-cy5? or it works as fine? i got cosed sorry. id rather have cy8 than cy5 thats why i ask
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Funkstation777 on September 24, 2011, 02:04:09 PM
Hi, just for Info:

to use the CY-8 as a hihat, you need additional material, which seems to be already packed in the CY-5.
Also you have to widen the hole of the cymbal to make it fit on the Hihat assembly. The Choke-Function on the CY-8 is no problem for the hihat playing, although you won't really need it. (Is there ANY drummer outside who chokes his hihat by hand???)

The CY-5 was not available at the moment when I needed a Hihat-cymbal, so I took the CY-8. Not it is available and I will use the CY-8 as a crash.

Regards,
Andy from Red Bull Country
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 24, 2011, 05:39:07 PM
ok you convinced me my friend. i dont wanna cash out in extra material. cy-5 for me. i wish i hadnt sold mine a while back...so stupid of me
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on September 24, 2011, 06:31:33 PM
ok you convinced me my friend. i dont wanna cash out in extra material. cy-5 for me. i wish i hadnt sold mine a while back...so stupid of me

HI B.A.

You don t like the 2BOX hihat pad ?  you could use it , even with manfred's board ....

And just a question , why did you buy this board as you have a 2BOX hihat .... i m not sure you ll get a better control than with the original one ....
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 24, 2011, 08:15:21 PM
i havent bought it yet my friend. i wait a pm from manfred.
yes i have original hi hat
it is good but i have 2 things
first it makes me feel i will break it. really. the center of it moves to much for me to be calm that it will last
secondly i hate the stand. i am gonna buy (probably on june when my mate from ny comes to greece to give it to me cheap,) a pearl eliminator h2000 hi hat stand so, to put something there, i thing it will be better to use cy5 than the original...

thats my iopinion


why do you say that i may not have same control mate?
you had any problems?

manfreds solution realy solves my hands and makes me use a good hi hat stand that doesnt move sideways and also is a real eye catcher lol


cheers
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Funkstation777 on September 25, 2011, 11:16:22 AM
Hello BA,

when my old drummer was using the 2box set, he moved very quickly from the original Hihat pedal to a pearl pedal. No matter what brand you use, they all work with the 2box-Hihat-cymbal!

The only important thing IMO is, that you have to get a pedal, where you can set the spring tension, which is not possible with the original 2box pedal, which moves much too easy with it's weak return spring.
Unfortunately I sold the whole kit (just kept the 2box module for me) so I had to get another Hihat brand when we got back using trigger drums in my rehearsal room, cause there is still not even one crappy 2box-cymbal available (that's something I still find extremely fu**ed, cause IMO the 2box cymbals really did a great job.


Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: roel on September 25, 2011, 11:50:07 AM
Hello BA,

when my old drummer was using the 2box set, he moved very quickly from the original Hihat pedal to a pearl pedal. No matter what brand you use, they all work with the 2box-Hihat-cymbal!

The only important thing IMO is, that you have to get a pedal, where you can set the spring tension, which is not possible with the original 2box pedal, which moves much too easy with it's weak return spring.
Unfortunately I sold the whole kit (just kept the 2box module for me) so I had to get another Hihat brand when we got back using trigger drums in my rehearsal room, cause there is still not even one crappy 2box-cymbal available (that's something I still find extremely fu**ed, cause IMO the 2box cymbals really did a great job.

yes 2box cymbals are working great also the 2box hihat, I don't get it why people wanna switch there 2box hihat for a roland..you'll get the best results using the original 2box hihat.If you don't like the hihatstand buy a better one.And use the latest update v1.20
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on September 25, 2011, 12:15:09 PM

why do you say that i may not have same control mate?
you had any problems?

manfreds solution realy solves my hands and makes me use a good hi hat stand that doesnt move sideways and also is a real eye catcher lol


cheers

i didnt said manfred's board is worse than the 2 box controller ... i just think it will be the same .

I ve bought one ( in fact 2... ;)  ) and it works really well for me ...

... and yes , you re right , if you dont feel confident with your actual hats , go for it ....

have a nice day
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on September 25, 2011, 12:36:14 PM
yes 2box cymbals are working great also the 2box hihat, I don't get it why people wanna switch there 2box hihat for a roland..you'll get the best results using the original 2box hihat.If you don't like the hihatstand buy a better one.And use the latest update v1.20

Hi,

in my opinion the 2Box hihat has some disadvantages. But these disadvantages are more or less a matter of taste:

- playing foot chicks mostly triggers zone 4 too
- distance between closed and fully open is small (weak magnet)
- size and playing feel

It is great if the 2Box hihat works perfectly for you. But obviously there are quite a few people who are not totally satisfied and like to use other cymbals. No matter if it is a Roland, Yamaha, DIY or whatever. And the results are not worse than with the 2Box hihat, you can get at least the same results with separate board and cymbal.

Regards, Manfred

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 25, 2011, 02:51:02 PM
manfred i sent payments etc.
hey guys any idea idea where i could find a piece of (dunno what is called, i will call it scritch scratch)this thing that you put on the bottom of the stand and on bottom of grey box and they attach together like thse shoe scratches?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on September 25, 2011, 07:16:15 PM

hey guys any idea idea where i could find a piece of (dunno what is called, i will call it scritch scratch)this thing that you put on the bottom of the stand and on bottom of grey box and they attach together like thse shoe scratches?

This is called VELCRO ... ask a girl if she knows where to buy some ... i guess you can buy some where you buy stuff to make clothes ...  or just tear an old pair of shoes ;)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on September 25, 2011, 07:31:49 PM
ok thanx for that mate
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: roel on September 25, 2011, 08:30:40 PM
Hi,

in my opinion the 2Box hihat has some disadvantages. But these disadvantages are more or less a matter of taste:

- playing foot chicks mostly triggers zone 4 too
- distance between closed and fully open is small (weak magnet)
- size and playing feel

It is great if the 2Box hihat works perfectly for you. But obviously there are quite a few people who are not totally satisfied and like to use other cymbals. No matter if it is a Roland, Yamaha, DIY or whatever. And the results are not worse than with the 2Box hihat, you can get at least the same results with separate board and cymbal.

Regards, Manfred

For me the 2box hihat works great,but its a matter of taste what you prefer indeed.
maby I will buy a better hihatstand in the future who knows.For now I will using the 2box hihatstand.
Will this mod work with a Kit-Toy Hihat?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Louis on October 13, 2011, 07:07:52 PM
Just got JMan's stealth hihat together with Manfreds board. It feels great! Amazing what a feeling, it is really close to an acoustic hihat!   :patbat2box:

Since I live in Sweden and it is the right time of the year, I would like to give Manfred and JMan the nobel prize in edrumming for their work on hihat improvements.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 14, 2011, 03:51:29 AM
Glad you like it Louis!  ;D It's great having other options now using Manfred's controller box! J
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: digitalDrummer on October 14, 2011, 10:16:49 AM
Just got JMan's stealth hihat together with Manfreds board. It feels great! Amazing what a feeling, it is really close to an acoustic hihat!   :patbat2box:

Since I live in Sweden and it is the right time of the year, I would like to give Manfred and JMan the nobel prize in edrumming for their work on hihat improvements.
What kind of magnet did you use?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Louis on October 14, 2011, 03:41:09 PM
What kind of magnet did you use?

Sorry, I don't know, I got it from a friend. It is much stronger than the magnets on my fridge.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on October 15, 2011, 02:39:52 PM
manfred i just got it from my mate. thanx man
cant check it yet, i will check it in june most probably as i will need my bussy from ny to get me a new hi hat stand and then buy also a cy-5. but it is great to have everything else ready

ps. i got the magnets from jman link. i cant believe how strong they are. i cant get 2 of em apart from each other
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 15, 2011, 08:39:09 PM
I ordered some lower strength N28 magnets today. I just want to do some testing to see how the N28 magnet responds compared to my stronger N42 magnet. The N42 magnets sure give you a wide range  of openness and you can have your closed position setup so the magnet does not need to be very close to the sensor. Fully closed right now my magnet is still about 3/4" above my sensor. That is good as it means the pedal is no where near to "smashing" into the jack/controller box when fully closed. I have noticed that I can get an occasional foot splash (zone 9 ) sound though instead of edge (zone 8 ) when playing closed edge on the hat. I think this is something Manfred mentioned earlier about behavior of Strong magnets.....

So I think it would be good to get feedback on what magnet people are using and what kind of response they are getting.

I ordered some of these, and will give some feedback after I get them and test them:
https://www.kjmagnetics.com/proddetail.asp?prod=ZB66
J
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on October 16, 2011, 12:07:41 AM
unfortunately i wont be able to test till june. so jman if you find out that other magnets work better, please do tell.btw does it matter what side of the magnet i put underneath the pedal and what side is up or down of the circuit board? thanx
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on October 16, 2011, 01:55:34 AM
Hello,

@BA

Yes, the orientation of the magnet matters, it's a 50/50 chance. And i also recommend to approximate the magnet from the bottom layer. Thats the layer with the tiny surface mounted components.

@Jman

The problem i mentioned with too strong magnets is an overlap between open bow and closed edge. Let me try to explain it a bit more detailed. Both zone detection and level detection are done by measuring the current through the sensor. With my regular hihat and regular magnet i had the following values:

Level       Zone         Current

open        Bow           4,58mA
closed      Bow           3,98mA

open        Edge         5,99mA
closed      Edge         5,40mA

The following picture illustrates that. The x-axis shows the current through the sensor (not true to scale):

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/Zones_1.png)


By using a stronger magnet you can extend the range between open and closed for both zones. But this also means that the gap between both zones is getting smaller:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/Zones_2.png)


By using a magnet which is too strong the gap between both zones tends to zero. And if this gap doesn't exist anymore the module can not differentiate between open bow sounds and closed edge sounds properly.

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/Zones_3.png)

But i could only get that at some early tests at my desk with a very strong magnet and a very small distance between sensor and circuit board. Assembled to the hihat stand i didn't see this anymore.

You mentioned that you have zone 9 sounds while playing closed edge from time to time. To detect zone 9 the change of the current over time is crucial (di/dt). To trigger a foot splash you need to have a change in the current in a short time. Currently i have no explanation why this could happen while playing the edge without moving the pedal.

Do the others notice similar effects?

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 16, 2011, 03:36:39 AM
Hi Manfred: When I was experimenting with different gaps (open/closed travel) and having the magnet at different distances from the sensor at the full closed position, I did get the open bow sound instead of closed edge sound a few times .... This has never been a problem, just happened a couple times while I was trying different gaps. And the next time I regapped it went away, so I didn't really figure out why that happened. Now that you have explained that, it was most likely when I had set up with the magnet closer to the sensor in the box... Tomorrow I'll see if I can verify that.

As far as the occasional unexpected triggering of Zone 9 ..... With my Hi Hat I use top and bottom cymbals, the bottom cymbal doesn't have much function mainly real look and feel.... but the top cymbal does close against the bottom cymbal at the closed position .... so mechanically it does emulate the real HH movement very well. I will also test the function of my Hi Hat tomorrow with NO bottom cymbal just to see if that is a contributing factor as they do both move when playing in the closed position. Just thinking that maybe the movement is causing a foot pedal movement too, I am not aware of....
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on October 16, 2011, 09:25:34 AM
thank you all. i will await for a link for magnets that work really well in thefuture. i have trust in jman and his experiments!!! take care
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 16, 2011, 07:32:39 PM
OK, So today I decided to recalibrate my Hi Hat again before anything else. Just for the heck of it I went back and read the latest HH calib instructions for the 1.20 OS version. I probably overlooked this little phrase at the end (in red) of the instructions:

CALIB to calibrate the hihat. Press it once and a closed hihat symbol will blink. Now loosen the
hihat and let it rest on the hihat receiver and press CALIB, now an open hihat symbol will blink.
Open the hihat to the position where the sound should just reach completely open and press
CALIB once more. Finally fix it at a (possibly higher) open position.

So when calibrating I set the up position a little higher like suggested after doing the calibration. Maybe it is a coincidence, maybe not, but just prior to recalibration I was getting the occasional zone 9 mishit when playing zone 8 (edge) closed. Now, after playing for 5 or 10 minutes I have not had a single mishit... So for now, I'm going with "if it ain't broke don't fix it"  ;D.... all is working beautifully. The N42 magnets work fine.

I had a couple different N42 magnets ... This is the one I am using now ... but the other 3/8" thickness one I linked earlier works just fine as well:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-Neodymium-Ring-Magnets-3-4-x-1-4-x-1-4-Rare-Earth-N42-/200658279765?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eb82a5d55

Like I mentioned earlier I have some weaker N28 magnets ordered and will try one out when they arrive. But my guess is Manfred's HH controller is pretty versatile and a wide variety of magnets should work fine. The N42's that I have definitely do a great job!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on October 16, 2011, 11:49:36 PM
that is good to know mate keep us posted on all tests!!!
you are an asset to the community
ps one question. if i ever break a cymbal and get one of yours it will have all 3 zones,right?
my question though is this. will it be loud like a real cymbal?or you also make em plastic coated so they dontmake noise? cheers
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 17, 2011, 12:31:05 AM
that is good to know mate keep us posted on all tests!!!
you are an asset to the community
ps one question. if i ever break a cymbal and get one of yours it will have all 3 zones,right?
my question though is this. will it be loud like a real cymbal?or you also make em plastic coated so they dontmake noise? cheers
Yes, crashes and rides 3 zones plus choke like 2Box cymbals. I don't coat the top .. only the bottom for dampening, otherwise you loose the real cymbal response/feel. People have applied top dampening on my cymbals, like Zildjian mutes, or even a polymere coat here: http://www.vdrums.com/forum/showthread.php?54656-Stealth-A-to-E-cymbal-stick-noise-silencing&highlight=stealth%20dampening
But most prefer the naked cymbal feel.  I demo acoustic noise levels on my drums and cymbals on most of my videos, just check out any of those for an idea... J

sorry if I hijacked the thread Manfred :-[
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: digitalDrummer on October 17, 2011, 06:01:11 AM
I am testing someething similar to these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/20-Neodymium-Magnets-3-16-x-1-32-Disc-Rare-Earth-N42-/190580175854?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c5f76b3ee
One on its own didn't work at all - I'm now up to about 9 of them stuck together to get decent response. Luckily, they're small and thin, so it's possible to fit them without touching the box. It's not perfect, so I may add more and try and set them up a bit further away. The biggest issue is the difficulty in getting foot splashes, which are a bit erratic.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 17, 2011, 06:45:32 PM
I am testing someething similar to these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/20-Neodymium-Magnets-3-16-x-1-32-Disc-Rare-Earth-N42-/190580175854?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c5f76b3ee
One on its own didn't work at all - I'm now up to about 9 of them stuck together to get decent response. Luckily, they're small and thin, so it's possible to fit them without touching the box. It's not perfect, so I may add more and try and set them up a bit further away. The biggest issue is the difficulty in getting foot splashes, which are a bit erratic.

This is good info, obviously the size, not just the N class of the magnet makes a big difference. I imagine some have magnets handy around the house and we won't know the specs of what those are. But getting more feedback and specifics on what class and size magnets work best from other members will make it easy for those just starting out to get the best match.

I noticed on Manfred's gray box he put a mark on the top of his box so you can place the magnet in the appropriate position above the box. That is a good idea, something I did also on mine. It is also nice with the 3/4" diameter magnet .... you don't have to get the position perfect/dead center, plenty of room for slop in the placement. I am just guessing, but I would think you have to be more accurate with the small diameter magnet as far as positioning. Another reason more feedback will be nice.
(http://weblogimages.com/dajmando/2Bx%20HH%20cntrl%20-%20Copy.jpg)

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on October 17, 2011, 08:06:31 PM
yes but can someone show, in the plate, what is the thing that we have to put the magnet directly above? thank you
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 17, 2011, 09:28:38 PM
yes but can someone show, in the plate, what is the thing that we have to put the magnet directly above? thank you
In the Pink:
(http://weblogimages.com/dajmando/kHihatAdapter.jpg)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on October 17, 2011, 09:38:11 PM
you are a god my friend
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 17, 2011, 09:46:45 PM
you are a god my friend
not even close ..... but thanks :-[ J
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on October 18, 2011, 03:49:31 AM
i FINALLY managed to track down a few different magnets and they arrived today, so in the next couple of days I will know which works best...I got a few different strengths and sizes so it will be interesting to see..
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Slap the drummer on October 19, 2011, 03:52:47 PM
I'm trying to think how else board and magnet cd be positioned......

mainly coz I don't like to have the footboard at much of an angle (when closed).

I suppose the main reasons AGAINST some kind of arrangement around the clutch/actual cymbal
are:-

a) difficulty of giving the board a secure base exactly level and perpendicular to the magnet (even
     though the magnet itself might easily be fixed to a cymbal)

b) vibration issues (from the drumming!) when in use


You guys seem all to have gone straightaway for the footboard setup.......  is that because of these
kind of reasons ? ?

Any thoughts and suggestions welcome !   :)

Cheers
Slap

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 20, 2011, 04:04:44 PM
I'm trying to think how else board and magnet cd be positioned......

mainly coz I don't like to have the footboard at much of an angle (when closed).

I suppose the main reasons AGAINST some kind of arrangement around the clutch/actual cymbal
are:-

a) difficulty of giving the board a secure base exactly level and perpendicular to the magnet (even
     though the magnet itself might easily be fixed to a cymbal)

b) vibration issues (from the drumming!) when in use


You guys seem all to have gone straightaway for the footboard setup.......  is that because of these
kind of reasons ? ?

Any thoughts and suggestions welcome !   :)

Cheers
Slap
When I first did the Hi Hat mod using the original 2Box PCB, this was the simplest way I could think of. The advantages are: it is somewhat universal for Hi Hat stands and it makes it possible to use many edrum cymbals with no modifications or little modification.

One idea to get it out from under the pedal would be to mount the box on some kind of L platform at the top of the stand then just place the magnet on the bottom of the top HH cymbal (single cymbal, no bottom cymbal)

You might be able to mount it between 2 cymbals, but it is a little bulky....... the box I am using wouldn't fit for sure.

Also, you could still use a similar bottom pedal type mount with a HH stand and place the box just outside the pedal, on the floor .... behind or beside the pedal, and simply attach some sort of extension platform from the pedal for the magnet. That gets the box out from under the pedal. If you look at the first HH box I did ... If you were to attach an extension from the bolt I had my magnet on you could easily move the magnet where needed and place the box outside the pedal and make it possible to close the pedal much lower:
http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,722.0.html
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on October 20, 2011, 10:05:45 PM
I'm going to look into trying to mount Manfred's circuit into the bottom of my VH-12 so that I can use them with a drop clutch (as you can imagine, the box under the pedal won't work with a drop clutch)...
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 21, 2011, 02:16:30 AM
I'm going to look into trying to mount Manfred's circuit into the bottom of my VH-12 so that I can use them with a drop clutch (as you can imagine, the box under the pedal won't work with a drop clutch)...

I went the Mechanical pedal/hardware route for clutch.... bought this years ago .... Tama Cobra Clutch, it locks the pedal in whatever position you want. I usually set it for a semi open position... not super cheap, but pretty cool....
(http://weblogimages.com/dajmando/Tama%20Cobra%20Clutch%20Pedal.jpg)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on October 21, 2011, 03:51:19 AM
Holy hell, that thing is $250 over here!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on October 21, 2011, 04:56:03 AM
Holy hell, that thing is $250 over here!
WHoaaa!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Slap the drummer on October 21, 2011, 10:34:08 AM
... If you were to attach an extension from the bolt I had my magnet on you could easily move the magnet where needed and place the box outside the pedal and make it possible to close the pedal much lower:
http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,722.0.html

DuH! I didn't think of extending the magnet out like that.  That wd be an easy solution if I needed
to move the box out from under the pedal.

Thanks
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Slap the drummer on October 21, 2011, 10:36:58 AM
Holy hell, that thing is $250 over here!

I don't get it.....  why not just make up a "semi-open" .dsnd file and then you can "dial in"
the clutch from the module.....    no doubt I'm missing something  :)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: twisted.mellow on October 21, 2011, 12:20:49 PM
The purpose of the drop clutch is to hit it while you are playing and drop the top hat, for a closed sound for a section of the song. The only thing that is needed to re-engage the clutch is to put the foot down on the pedal. How could I do that with the module?

Speaking of which, it would be nice if 2Box had some footswitch capability or external midi command support...
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Slap the drummer on October 21, 2011, 03:48:08 PM
The only thing that is needed to re-engage the clutch is to put the foot down on the pedal. How could I do that with the module?

that'll be the something I was missing then
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Slap the drummer on October 21, 2011, 04:15:48 PM
Yeah I didn't realize the idea was to move back and forth in the middle of a number....
man that's some crazy sh!t.

Mind you, you could make a special file where the 100% open layer was the closed
sound of your choice, then just remember to keep away from fully open inbetweentimes....

Or I suppose yopu cd just buy a drop clutch  ;D
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on October 21, 2011, 04:36:28 PM

Speaking of which, it would be nice if 2Box had some footswitch capability or external midi command support...


Hi,

i had a similar idea to use a (foot-)switch instead of a mechanical dropclutch. Maybe you saw already this topic with the schematic and a youtube video:

http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,592.0.html (http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,592.0.html)

Regards, Manfred


Edit: By the way, i thought about implementing this to the circuit board. But then i decided to keep the board smaller. I was afraid that it is getting bulky with another connector for the switch.

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on October 22, 2011, 07:28:37 PM
hi

I tried to use a ROLAND PD-8 as hihat cymbal , with Manf'sBOX , and it works great... zone 8 & 4 are triggered fine

Those pads are PIEZO(head) / SWITCH(rim) , just like 2BOX cymbals are ...

You can also use them for cymbals , and choke works also if you squeeze the rim ...

ok , it s not very good looking , but those pads are cheap and easy to find on the second hand market ...

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: roel on October 28, 2011, 12:30:38 PM
so Manfred you make these boxes at home? what's the price for 1?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on October 29, 2011, 02:35:22 PM

Hi,

right now i don't have completed boards ready but i still have something between 10 and 20 sets of components. So if you are interested in either a set of components or a completed board just send me a PM.

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on November 05, 2011, 05:02:59 PM

Hi,

since there are a few users who are interested in one of the boards i want to give a short update. As already said i have something between 10 and 15 sets of components left but no completed boards right now.

I need to spend a whole day to complete the boards because it doesn't make sense for me to do just a single board. And unfortunately i haven't had the time up to now. So please give me some more time. I will answer each PM once i have boards ready.

Sorry for the delay,

Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: roel on November 05, 2011, 07:33:42 PM
I'll be patient first I need a better hihatstand and then we will see further.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on November 06, 2011, 02:43:34 PM
i did the opposite lol. first got the board, and i am waiting for summer to get a new h2000 hhstand!!!and i also need a cy-5 btw!!!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on November 19, 2011, 09:00:13 PM

Hey guys,

today i tried to build some boards but after 4 pcs. i gave up because of a reject rate of 100%. Soldering the tiny sensor chip is really pain in the a... I think i need other ideas how to do that otherwise it is getting to expensive for me.

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on November 19, 2011, 10:51:18 PM
Hey guys,

today i tried to build some boards but after 4 pcs. i gave up because of a reject rate of 100%. Soldering the tiny sensor chip is really pain in the a... I think i need other ideas how to do that otherwise it is getting to expensive for me.

Regards, Manfred
I was amazed you were able to solder any of those. When I looked through a magnifying glass at the A1392 hall effects sensor I could just barely make out the 6 posts/pads!!! That was the point when I knew I wouldn't stand a chance soldering to that with my large, clunky hands ;D I had hoped they made something similar, but with legs like some of the hall sensors, but never found anything.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on November 19, 2011, 11:17:32 PM
Hey guys,

today i tried to build some boards but after 4 pcs. i gave up because of a reject rate of 100%. Soldering the tiny sensor chip is really pain in the a... I think i need other ideas how to do that otherwise it is getting to expensive for me.

Regards, Manfred
Here's a link to one interesting method/instructable involving a toaster oven:
http://www.instructables.com/id/Toaster-Oven-Reflow-Soldering-BGA/?ALLSTEPS
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on November 20, 2011, 12:18:09 AM
Hi Jman,

thanks for the link. My problem right now is not the soldering itself. I have access to a rework station from time to time which makes soldering easy:

http://www.ersa.com/art-smt-bga-rework-346-1482.html

But the problem is to apply the right amount of solder paste. I didn't invest in a stencil for the solder mask which means i have to do it manually with an injection. That was not really successful today. Maybe next time i try in two steps. Tin coating of the board in a first step and the sensor with flux in a second step.

Another idea would be to order the boards with the SMT components already soldered. But this would be a high investment which i actually don't want to do. Remember that this is just a "community thing" and i'm neither a company nor a dealer.

Best thing would indeed be to find a sensor which doesn't even require a printed circuit board. Then everybody could do it on its own at home with a perfboard. Maybe i should think about another solution.

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on December 04, 2011, 07:29:44 PM

Hi again,

meanwhile i found a good way to solder the sensor chip. So if somebody is still interested just send me a PM. I have a couple of boards ready now (soldered, cleaned, tested).

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: SHwoKing on December 04, 2011, 07:56:20 PM
This is good news Manfred, thank you for taking the time to do such thing.

PM sent  ;D

This box coupled with Jman's A to E Hi Hat kit should seal the deal !
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Slap the drummer on December 05, 2011, 11:51:02 AM
Many thanks Manfred  :)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Slap the drummer on December 23, 2011, 06:09:55 PM
Well I got my hihat boards from Manfred now.....

WOW!  they look fantastic, I'm amazed somebody can make something like that without
being a factory !

 :drum3:
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on December 25, 2011, 04:17:25 AM
This is good news Manfred, thank you for taking the time to do such thing.

PM sent  ;D

This box coupled with Jman's A to E Hi Hat kit should seal the deal !
tell me more about this hi hat maaaaannnnn
i was thinking of getting the cy-5. is this hi hat better?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: SHwoKing on December 25, 2011, 05:49:39 PM
The kit Jman sells is not cymbals ot Hi Hats (well for me that was some cymbals but this is another story  ;D).

The Hi Hat kit consist of a two clear dampening sheet, a trigger assembly, a small rubber ring (scpacer) for cable path, mounting screws and nuts.
Jman also gives you instructions to install the kit properly.

For a more detailed insight, I suggest you to read an article on Digital Drummer starting on page 43
http://issuu.com/digitaldrummer/docs/digtaldrummer_april2010

You can also visit Jman website :  http://stealthdrums.com/Purchase.html

To sum this up, the kit allows you to use any acoustic cymbals or Hi-Hats as E-cymbals/E-Hi hat.. And Jman is the first one to provide a cymbal kit dedicated for 2box with 3 zones and choke.

For Hi-Hat, this is another story as any cymbal will work as long as you use Manfred's board but you already have one.

For me now, i have yet to get a 2box module in february and will start mounting the Hi Hat kit during the same period.

Slap the drummer should be able to tell what he thinks about it soon as I read he bought some kits to Jman as well.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on December 25, 2011, 06:56:10 PM
i see. i thought they were electronic hi hats. they look amazing but for me noise is af utter importance...
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: eyerichards on December 27, 2011, 03:05:56 AM
Hi guys, merry Xmas for the other day. For those of you who own ddrum4 kits, I can happily report that used in conjunction with Manfreds sensor board the ddrum 4 hi hat pad works brilliantly  :rock: I've only tested it for 15 minutes but already it will be my main gigging hat and I'll keep the 2 box hat for practice at home as it's quieter.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: roel on December 30, 2011, 08:14:01 PM
soon I will get my new DW 5000 2LEG Hihatstand!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: phaynes on January 22, 2012, 05:49:49 PM
Hi Manfred.

I just sent you a PM but it is not showing in my 'sent messages'? please let me know if you did not receive and I will re-send.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: codswallop on January 22, 2012, 07:18:14 PM
I would like to buy 1 please, i have Paypal. What's the cost? you have email? instructions are with it?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: codswallop on January 23, 2012, 11:25:27 PM
Where did he go?

Must have dreamt it  :)

Yes if you see this and have the goods then i have the funds. :animal:

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on January 24, 2012, 02:43:13 AM
Where did he go?

Must have dreamt it  :)

Yes if you see this and have the goods then i have the funds. :animal:
I know when I was talking about SD card specs with Manfred earlier in the month, he had a very busy schedule .... and travelling I believe. This Hi Hat controller is more of a nice favor he has been doing for us, definitely not a money making enterprise ... so, you'll prolly have to have some patience .... J
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: codswallop on January 24, 2012, 10:02:12 AM
Patience, wow i even tell the microwave to hurry up  :)

Seriously, yes of course i can wait.

I'm using the 2 box hi hat pad on a regular stand (now i figured how the thing tightens up, doh!)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on January 24, 2012, 04:27:56 PM
Patience, wow i even tell the microwave to hurry up  :)

Seriously, yes of course i can wait.

I'm using the 2 box hi hat pad on a regular stand (now i figured how the thing tightens up, doh!)
If you haven't done this ... send Manfred a Personal Msg. letting him know what you want ... that is probably easier for him to follow than in this thread ....  J
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 18, 2012, 03:40:58 PM
i dont remember where it was, i saw it in this board in the past,on tuesday my cy-5 and h-2000 hhat stand are coming finally
so i will put everything in place. all i need is the picture that showed where i should put the magnet. above which specific spot of the hh controller of manfred. if anyone can help...thanx
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on February 18, 2012, 06:26:24 PM
i dont remember where it was, i saw it in this board in the past,on tuesday my cy-5 and h-2000 hhat stand are coming finally
so i will put everything in place. all i need is the picture that showed where i should put the magnet. above which specific spot of the hh controller of manfred. if anyone can help...thanx
You asked that earlier.... look back at reply 79 in this thread...
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 18, 2012, 06:48:53 PM
what the hell? i promise i checked this threadtwice before i posted it. honestly. i must be going blind. thank you my friend. logically, on wednesday i will come with a review of the results i had!!!!

ps. does it matter if the cable i use(i need to buy another one obviously) is very long?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 22, 2012, 12:01:11 AM
ok my hi hat stand and my cy5 came. as also came my amazing snare mapex black panther sledgehammer. it kills guys

. so i rearranged everything. i put the brain on the left, and so i removed all cables and reput them. everything is fine. only thing i am missing is a piece of scratch tape to make manfreds box stable and put the magnet in place. without the magnet i checked and only zone 8 is trigerring. is that normal? (i guess it is). wonderful thing is that it trigers way better than 2box hh cymbal. though it is way smaller.
one more question. can i now make the 2box hihat cymbal as a china or crash or anything? will it work? and with how many zones?thank you


oops forgot the pics



(http://img804.imageshack.us/img804/1156/21022012656.jpg)

(http://img848.imageshack.us/img848/8883/22022012658.jpg)

(http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/9148/22022012659.jpg)

(http://img854.imageshack.us/img854/2011/22022012657.jpg)

(http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/7984/22022012660.jpg)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on February 22, 2012, 03:36:38 AM

one more question. can i now make the 2box hihat cymbal as a china or crash or anything? will it work? and with how many zones?thank you





hi BA

Yes you can .... but there is some modding needed .

here is a link to a post on this
http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,1182.msg11219.html#msg11219

About your hihat stand ... well i guess i have bad news.... :(

As yours dont have a metal plate under the pedal , i guess you ll have some problems ...

    Manfred's box is very sensitive , and even some millimeters movesments  between magnet and sensor will mess the calibration ...

It s obvious your stand will move , even just a bit .. also the box will move because the carpet isnt plane , and because of the pressure when your foot steps harder...

   In my case , even if my hihat stand has a plate , when i move the pedal from left to right ( it has a little play ...) the hh position changes a bit ...

best thing is to build a plate so the detection will be reliable...


Get a magnet , make some tests and you ll understand ... ;);););)

good luck mate and have fun  ... :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock:

(http://img11.hostingpics.net/pics/197529IMGP1053.jpg) (http://www.hostingpics.net/viewer.php?id=197529IMGP1053.jpg)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 22, 2012, 11:16:52 AM
thank you for everything mate. aboyt the plate you say, i can make the bov very stable. its easy. i will glue the box in a place the pedal has. also the magnet can get holdunder the fppt plate!!! it isnt metal, but somehow it gets stuck in some points. ill make itwork easily. a

about the hi hat. i did this. put the hi hat in the place of one of my crashes. first hit i get a crash sound. then second hit and all others, iget a bell sound. or a closed(crash?) sound. whatever i did. then i changed the type from cy12 to many others including kick 2 which gave bell sound. but once i put it back in cy12 type, not ot gives me crash sound all the type.
i hope i didnt fuck the hi hat huh?

so if it gives crash sound(ill use it probably as a splash or a china(prefer the china) i am fine right?
so what type of equipment do i need to mount it to the rack? as the 2box rod wont do as i need a round rod and also what felts i need under it and what rack mount? any ideas?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 22, 2012, 12:20:56 PM
there is nothing some tape and some paper wont fix. i put some paper under the foot board to make it even. i put then the magnet and stabilised it with some tape, in the exact spot it should be. because i noticed that if the magnet isnt exactly above the specific place of the board, it should be, it doesnt trigger. also it has to be farely close. i then stabilised manfreds board on the bottom of the pedal wit halso some tape. everything is in place. and trigers amazingly well. i am so happy i did this.
thank you manfred and everyone for the help. if anyone can also help me mount the hi hat as a cymbal i would be greatfull. if i am guessing corectly it wont move right? so perhaps i make it into a china.thanx
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on February 22, 2012, 01:51:18 PM
try this for the hihat....
http://www.thomann.de/fr/millenium_da_235_rack_hi_hat_halter.htm

for the foot board , try  to use something mor sturdy than cardboard  ... wood or metal for example
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 22, 2012, 02:27:57 PM
this seems nice my friend and thank you, but if i use this rod it has, then the hh cymbal would be way too low to use it properly. also, i dont have a need for the whole hh clatch mechanism. isnt there a similar clamp that accepts round rods (not the pentagonal rods like 2box uses), and also a long rod to use(preferably with the ability to turn so that i have the cymbal in an angle)?
would be much better. if anyone has any idea, that would be aweosme. ill go also to check in music stores near me. since i will need to buy a new cable for it. would a mono cable do the work i need perhaps? make it play a no chocked sound.? i ask this since someone in the other thread mentioned to get a split cable and use only one of the 2 splitted cables.


about the card board you mention, i didnt explain my self well. the bottom of the foot board has some (dunno how to describe it).
lets call them car lanes divided by iron walls. so all i did is in the spot i wanted to put the magnet, i stuffed the lanes wit hard paper to make it come in the level of the walls. and then i taped the magnet there. everythiung is very sturdy and well!!!ill try to take a picture and show you guys. thanx
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 24, 2012, 05:28:00 PM
i have to say, the overall feeling is so much better!!!! i cant really describe it. iam so happy
perhaps it is only cause of the hh stand. perhaps the 2box hihat would be as amazing as the cy-5, and all that mattered was the hh stand. i will check this when i return from my trip, but i do like so much the feel of cy-5. even though it is smaller than the 2box hhat. it feels more sturdy.
to anyone who is thinking about doing the mod, GO DO IT. ?? is worth it
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Rider on March 10, 2012, 02:03:24 AM
Hi manfred , sent u a pm hope u can reply soon

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on May 01, 2012, 09:33:46 PM

Hello,

just want to let you know that (almost) all boards are sold. For those whose PM i answered today there is still a board left. But thats it as long as none of these guys changes his mind.

I will keep 2-3 boards just in case somebody needs a replacement. But up to now none of the boards got damaged on its own as far as i know. Just one board that was connected to 48V phantom power by accident.

In addition there are some more boards which work but the soldering of the sensor chip does not look confidable. Don't want to sell these boards because i'm not sure if they are reliable. Just imagine it stops working while somebody is playing live on stage.....

Regards, Manfred

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on May 01, 2012, 09:47:22 PM
i want to say, thank you so much manfred for everything!!! hi hat with your borad and cy-5 works amazingly well!!!!
thank you so much
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Drumaster on May 29, 2012, 08:11:39 PM
Hi guyz!

Just received Manfred's hi-hat board and after a loooooong loooong setting (finding the proper magnet side, setting the good distance between it and the sensor, fixing properly the board etc), I can now say that it works like a charm!
I can't compare with an original 2Box hi-hat as I use the board with a Roland VH-12 but, even if it does not reach TD-20X hi-hat expressiveness, it's quite good and I'm happy with it!

Splash works great also and I get all the 5 sound steps to open the hi-hat.

Thanks again Manfred!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on May 29, 2012, 09:22:47 PM

Hi,

thanks for the feedback, nice to hear that it works good with your VH12! Yes, its still some DIY to find the right distance between magnet and sensor. And also to fix the board and sensor properly.

Regards, Manfred


PS. The number of "half-open" levels depends on the sound you are using. I think most of the stock sounds have 3-5 levels in total from closed to open. But in theory you can also create sounds with up to 7 levels (bow and edge) plus foot splash. The "only" problem is to find samples. I think even Superior Drummer and BFD don't have that much levels.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Drumaster on May 31, 2012, 07:07:04 PM
Hello,

I fixed the board with a phone leather case and some tape. It does not seem to move.

Here are the pics:
(http://lajulie.free.fr/hh1.jpg)

(http://lajulie.free.fr/hh2.jpg)

It's working like a charm, good to have some real HH sounds now (TD-20X sounds before)!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on May 31, 2012, 07:20:59 PM
Hello,

I fixed the board with a phone leather case and some tape. It does not seem to move.

Here are the pics:
(http://lajulie.free.fr/hh1.jpg)

(http://lajulie.free.fr/hh2.jpg)

It's working like a charm, good to have some real HH sounds now (TD-20X sounds before)!
Sure looks vulnerable to accidents/breakage!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Drumaster on May 31, 2012, 08:02:41 PM
Jman > Don't worry, it's impossible as the pedal/magnet can't touch the board, even when strongly pressing the pedal. I just have to keep the same gap (quite narrow here as it's my playing style) between the hi-hat cymbal and the top of the hi-hat stand and it's 100% safe. :)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: ddrummer68 on May 31, 2012, 10:11:05 PM
I understand your confidence, but I would find a way to loosen the clutch at exactly the wrong time.   :animal:
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Drumaster on June 01, 2012, 08:37:54 PM
Yeah right but I never loosen the clutch, when I find my setting I don't touch it anymore, and I broke the plastic box that came with the board with my drill. :p

And with the plastic box I need a very strong magnet right?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on June 02, 2012, 05:12:47 PM

Hi,

the plastic box is really easy to brake with the drill. I did that too with my first box. I bought them from Conrad by the way:

http://www.conrad.de/ce/de/product/522376/M-GEHAEUSE-55-X-28-X-51

english version:

http://www.conrad.com/M-enclosure-55-x-28-x-51.htm?websale7=conrad-int&pi=522376&cc=y

At the online shop they are even a bit cheaper compared to the real store. But shipping cost is pretty high. However, maybe you can find a similar box in a local store.

A plastic box shouldn't have too much influence on the magnet. But metal boxes would have a big influence depending on what kind of metal it is.

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: ddrummer68 on June 03, 2012, 01:48:50 PM
Thanks to Manfred, Jman, and the other posters here, I've gotten to an imperfect, but very workable hi-hat set up.   I'd previously bought a set of Zildjian AEs, which are great for playability and volume, but not great for sound quality.

But with Manfred's hi-hat box, I was able to keep my Remote Speedy Hat with the AEs, and just add a Hart 12" hat right above it.  So, there's only one hi-hat pedal, and it's easy to jump back and forth between the AE hats and the 2box/Hart hat.  Pretty cool, and so i just wanted to thank you for sharing the information and encouragement. 
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waynec42 on June 29, 2012, 08:52:27 AM
Hello,

just want to let you know that (almost) all boards are sold. For those whose PM i answered today there is still a board left. But thats it as long as none of these guys changes his mind.

I will keep 2-3 boards just in case somebody needs a replacement. But up to now none of the boards got damaged on its own as far as i know. Just one board that was connected to 48V phantom power by accident.

In addition there are some more boards which work but the soldering of the sensor chip does not look confidable. Don't want to sell these boards because i'm not sure if they are reliable. Just imagine it stops working while somebody is playing live on stage.....

Regards, Manfred

Any boards left? I think I want one.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on June 29, 2012, 07:28:35 PM

Hello,

sorry but i don't have any more boards. And there are no plans for a new batch right now.

Regards, Manfred
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waynec42 on June 29, 2012, 10:44:52 PM
Hello,

sorry but i don't have any more boards. And there are no plans for a new batch right now.

Regards, Manfred

Bummer. My hihat has failed. I think the 2box hihat is poorly designed with the delicate electronic part being built into the moving part of the cymbal that gets jarred by the foot pedal and hit with the stick.

Please let me know if you decide to get more made.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: olijack on October 07, 2012, 09:25:28 AM
Hello everybody,

I'm very interesting to get this PCB in odrer to change my Roland sound module for 2box one. It seems that manfred has no more PCB, then I would like to reproduce it. Does anyone has the schema or drawing of this PCB with the details of components? It will be great to send me.

Thank by advance.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Murgen on October 07, 2012, 10:03:13 AM
The PCB-board is not that delicate as long as it is safely tucked away in it's metal housing. Reading all the stuff from Manfred and Jman and looking at the pictures it is worthwhile to open the casing and check the PCB. Manfred's was not properly cleaned and the chemical's used to make the copper prints (basically acid removing all copper except the print-layout) were slowly rotting the vital parts away.

You can also move the original PCB to another place (under the footpedal) with a magnet on the footblade.

I think the concept is smart, the magnet and sensor cannot wear out.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Manfred on November 24, 2012, 06:39:52 PM

Hello,

i still get requests from time to time about the board. The problem i have with another batch is that i had to advance a lot of money and i'm not sure how much users are really interested. I wouldn't mind to spend some time for a second batch but i definitely would mind if i couldn't cover the expenses.

Based on the numbers for the first batch the price for the board would be around 30,- Euro plus (worldwide) shipping which is another 8 Euro.

So assuming there will be another batch of a slightly modified but very similar board who would be interested? Could those who are sure that they would want a board please drop me a PM?

There is no order for boards or components placed up to now but i would like to have an estimation about the risk for the advance money.

Regards, Manfred

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on November 24, 2012, 08:13:43 PM
Hello,

i still get requests from time to time about the board. The problem i have with another batch is that i had to advance a lot of money and i'm not sure how much users are really interested. I wouldn't mind to spend some time for a second batch but i definitely would mind if i couldn't cover the expenses.

Based on the numbers for the first batch the price for the board would be around 30,- Euro plus (worldwide) shipping which is another 8 Euro.

So assuming there will be another batch of a slightly modified but very similar board who would be interested? Could those who are sure that they would want a board please drop me a PM?

There is no order for boards or components placed up to now but i would like to have an estimation about the risk for the advance money.

Regards, Manfred
Hi Manfred great to hear from you! It would be great if you decide to do another batch! ... I'll PM you. I wonder if it might be a good option for you once you get some response and have an idea how many boards to shoot for ....  to get a 50%-?% down pre-order type payment from those ordering. This would at least defer a little bit of the initial investment.  J
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Murgen on November 24, 2012, 09:14:15 PM
I will chip in for a genuine Manfred board.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Haggis-man on November 24, 2012, 10:20:33 PM
PM'd! I'm also up for paying in advance!

Cheers
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on November 25, 2012, 03:01:00 AM
Hello,

i still get requests from time to time about the board. The problem i have with another batch is that i had to advance a lot of money and i'm not sure how much users are really interested. I wouldn't mind to spend some time for a second batch but i definitely would mind if i couldn't cover the expenses.

Based on the numbers for the first batch the price for the board would be around 30,- Euro plus (worldwide) shipping which is another 8 Euro.

So assuming there will be another batch of a slightly modified but very similar board who would be interested? Could those who are sure that they would want a board please drop me a PM?

There is no order for boards or components placed up to now but i would like to have an estimation about the risk for the advance money.

Regards, Manfred

yep...I'll PM you too.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: digitalDrummer on November 25, 2012, 08:03:05 AM
HI Manfred, to help reduce the cost for Australians, I'm happy to act as a drop box. If any Aussies interested in the board can PM me, we can do a joint order and I'll on-ship locally.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waynec42 on November 26, 2012, 06:39:05 AM
hi Manfred ...

Do you think it s possible to put such a circuit board and magnet inside a YAMAHA HH65 or similar HIHAT pedal ? I d prefere  to avoid the use of a HIHAT stand ...

Did you get an answer to your question about the HH65?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: thrash4life on December 18, 2012, 07:36:15 PM
PM'd as well! - I'd love one of these to hook up to JMan's HH conversion kit. \m/
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Timh on January 05, 2013, 03:14:31 PM
PM'd as well

I want to get one as well..  can pay in advance want to get a Jman Hat Conversion...

hope you make them
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: sandman on January 19, 2013, 09:13:10 AM
Anybody know how to get in touch with Manfred? Tried to contact him via PM but no reply but I see he has been active on the forum. I need to buy one of his circuit board mods.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on January 19, 2013, 10:32:44 AM
Anybody know how to get in touch with Manfred? Tried to contact him via PM but no reply but I see he has been active on the forum. I need to buy one of his circuit board mods.

he must be busy with his own work .... wait a bit ,i m sure he will answear you ..
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: SHwoKing on February 03, 2013, 12:19:49 PM
I've finally gone the DIY way for the Hi hat using Manfred's board so here is the installation :

(http://imageshack.us/a/img338/1312/dsc02110rt.jpg)

(http://imageshack.us/a/img14/145/dsc02111g.jpg)

(http://imageshack.us/a/img208/1284/dsc02109sb.jpg)


The box is firmly attached to the Tama Speedcobra Hi hat stand using two screws already there to allow the rubber part to slide.
I should get another one and do proper hole now that I know where I should drill the box.

The magnet is tiny but quiet powerful. I think I have to change it because if I set the pedal to minimum, I start to have some weird triggering going on.

Otherwise, the board works like wonder wether I use a Yamaha 135 or Jman's A to E Hi hat.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 03, 2013, 12:48:22 PM
hows the speedcobra double pedal? i adore my pearl eliminator 2002b but the speed cobra has caught my eye from the first moment it got launched
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: SHwoKing on February 03, 2013, 01:01:33 PM
hows the speedcobra double pedal? i adore my pearl eliminator 2002b but the speed cobra has caught my eye from the first moment it got launched

Hi BA.

Like you maybe remember, I had the Eliminator before. I played on them for more than 1 year and was happy with it. Few weeks ago, I was able to get the Speedcobra used but like new for a very cheap price (50€) by buying different drum related stuffs and selling the ones I didn't needed (like EDTC suggested to me).

I must say I have adopted the Speedcobra very fastly. They feel more light than the Elim's but still have power. So if you like light feel they are very good for that. They just stay glued to your foot whatever they do. Longer Pedal board feel also more confortable for me. The only thing I will miss is the Soft Pearl Case vs the Tama hardcase.

I have done this cause I wanted a matching Hi hat stand and the Pearl H2000 is not suited to install a box under the pedal. Tama's stands are.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 03, 2013, 02:34:15 PM
thanx for the review. the thing is i have to try and i think they havent come yet in greece
btw i have fitted manfreds box under the h2000 pedal just fine. the speed cobra hi hat is it better than the eliminator one? (i wont change hardware of course i am just curious. cheers mate
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: SHwoKing on February 03, 2013, 04:31:04 PM
I dunno, I've never played an Pearl H2000. I can only say then Speedcobra is better than Gibraltar Liquid Drive in every aspect. Very sturdy, doesn't move an inch even if I stomp the pedal. This without using any spike. It is also very very smooth to a point i had to set the lever almost all the way up to feel it. But I have choosed it mainly for easy Manfred's board mountability, instant pedal folding and double pedal matching  :rock:

I think H2000 / Tama Lever Glide / DW9500 are a very close match in the Hi hat stand area.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on February 03, 2013, 04:49:04 PM
ok thank you my friend
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: SHwoKing on February 04, 2013, 07:03:08 AM
A question for people who are using a bottom cymbal for there Hi hat conversion :

If I use a Top and a bottom cymbal, I can't trigger the edge zone (zone 8) when both cymbals are in contact
It seems like you need a smaller bottom cymbal than top in order to trigger it correctly. Am I right ?

Roland VH13 seems build that way and Rob's mod too.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on February 04, 2013, 08:17:13 PM
Not sure if anyone else has spoken with Manfred, but he  messaged me the other day  and stated that he had not started on the new batch of boards because of lack of interest...not that folks were not interested...just that there were not enough of us. So....DIY it is.   ::) Tear into those hats boys.  ;)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waynec42 on February 05, 2013, 07:36:07 AM
Not sure if anyone else has spoken with Manfred, but he  messaged me the other day  and stated that he had not started on the new batch of boards because of lack of interest...not that folks were not interested...just that there were not enough of us. So....DIY it is.   ::) Tear into those hats boys.  ;)

Hard to believe there's little interest. I'll buy a batch if that's the case. I'm in Australia if that helps. Happy to distribute through the local distributor if that helps. Whatever it takes to get one :)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: edtc on February 05, 2013, 02:53:15 PM
i guess some people have stoped reading this post where Manfred said he wont produce some ..

maybe it s better to start a new post about it...
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: digitalDrummer on February 05, 2013, 11:18:29 PM
Happy to distribute through the local distributor if that helps. Whatever it takes to get one :)
Made the same offer a while back.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waxdass on February 06, 2013, 08:26:31 AM
Im in Australia and I'll def buy some!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Drumminator on February 06, 2013, 09:18:53 PM
Hi !

Is there anybody who has the schematic circuit drawings with components of the hihat adapter ?
(the pics showing the circuit in another thread of this forum are down)

Thanks !
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: tower of p on February 21, 2013, 02:21:48 PM
Hello,

i still get requests from time to time about the board. The problem i have with another batch is that i had to advance a lot of money and i'm not sure how much users are really interested.

Hi Manfred,

I´m interested and I also would see no problem in an in-advance- payment.

Would be grat if there were enough requests so that producing another batch is worthwile for you.

Grüße,
Lutz
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: drummertobi on April 07, 2013, 05:53:32 PM
Hi!

I get in contact with Manfred and asked him for a controller to finish my DIY-cymbal-project. Unfortunately he is very busy and has no time to make some new one.  :(

Does anybody here in the forum has a controller and do not use it anymore? Or does anybody know how to build this or a similar controller?

It would be great to hear from anybody so I can finish my DIY-project soon. It is on hold for about 4 weeks because I’m waiting for the controller or another way to solve the problem.

Thank you very much for any help.

Tobi
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on April 07, 2013, 08:02:52 PM
Hi!

I get in contact with Manfred and asked him for a controller to finish my DIY-cymbal-project. Unfortunately he is very busy and has no time to make some new one.  :(

Does anybody here in the forum has a controller and do not use it anymore? Or does anybody know how to build this or a similar controller?

It would be great to hear from anybody so I can finish my DIY-project soon. It is on hold for about 4 weeks because I’m waiting for the controller or another way to solve the problem.

Thank you very much for any help.

Tobi
Using the control board from the 2Box HH is another method, a few threads:
http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=722.msg7571#msg7571 (http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=722.msg7571#msg7571)
http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=1656.0 (http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=1656.0)
This one is at vdrums.com, not sure if Rob posted a thread on his project on this forum though.....
http://vdrums.com/forum/showthread.php?69213-2Box-HH-DIY-The-Mystery-Solved (http://vdrums.com/forum/showthread.php?69213-2Box-HH-DIY-The-Mystery-Solved)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: drummertobi on April 08, 2013, 07:33:53 PM
Hi JMAN,

thank you for all the links. But I think I will not do this with my 2box hh. I'd like to have both. The 2box hh for using at home and the controller with my cymbal hh for the band room. And I do not want to "kill" the original hh pad. So I look for a way to built a controller like Manfred do but this is not so easy to do and I found no other way in the internet building a controller for the 2box hh.

But thank you
Tobi
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on April 08, 2013, 09:12:29 PM
Hi JMAN,

thank you for all the links. But I think I will not do this with my 2box hh. I'd like to have both. The 2box hh for using at home and the controller with my cymbal hh for the band room. And I do not want to "kill" the original hh pad. So I look for a way to built a controller like Manfred do but this is not so easy to do and I found no other way in the internet building a controller for the 2box hh.

But thank you
Tobi

The way I built mine with the stock 2Box controller is totally reversable so "killing it" isn't an issue...but you'd still need another set hats if you wanted 2 hats.

I posted this here too but I never could get the pics to show up so here's the thread at vdrums with pics and walkthrough......

http://vdrums.com/forum/showthread.php?71888-VH-13-2Box-Hybrid-Remote-HH-Conversion
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on April 08, 2013, 09:19:41 PM
I didn't kill mine either. When I got a Manfred controller I re-attached my wires on the 2Box controller/Hi-Hat cymbal, put it back together and it worked as new.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: hemiboy on April 20, 2013, 06:38:30 AM
I really could use one for my new 2 box diy project. Please let me know if and when they are available and if I could buy one and have it shipped to me? I , too want bigger cymbals and stand mounted as well!
 Thanks In Advance
  hemiboy
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on April 20, 2013, 06:07:09 PM
I really could use one for my new 2 box diy project. Please let me know if and when they are available and if I could buy one and have it shipped to me? I , too want bigger cymbals and stand mounted as well!
 Thanks In Advance
  hemiboy

Looks like you really have very few choices....

...You either use the stock 2 Box hat as is.....

...or  Tear it apart and build a controller box from the stock parts and use whatever E cymbal you like.....

...or Buy some Gen16s to use in their factory form or  mod them with triggers(you'll still need to use a 2Box controller for the hats)

...or use A cymbals........ :-\
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waynec42 on April 21, 2013, 03:37:05 AM
Looks like you really have very few choices....

...You either use the stock 2 Box hat as is.....

...or  Tear it apart and build a controller box from the stock parts and use whatever E cymbal you like.....

...or Buy some Gen16s to use in their factory form or  mod them with triggers(you'll still need to use a 2Box controller for the hats)

...or use A cymbals........ :-\


Chuckle..

I wonder if 2box read these forums. If they do, I hope they've worked out that almost everyone hates the stock hihat because it simply doesn't work properly. I wish 2box were able to use the roland designed hihat. I guess it's too expensive.

I think the best solution right now is the second option above - tear it apart and build the controller box.

I plan to do this at stage.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: digitalDrummer on April 21, 2013, 07:54:23 AM

 almost everyone hates the stock hihat because it simply doesn't work properly
I think that's a bit harsh. It does work properly in terms of producing variable sounds. Some of us, however, don't like the feel - and that's a personal thing. I'm sure there are people who love it.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on April 22, 2013, 10:34:38 PM

Chuckle..

I wonder if 2box read these forums. If they do, I hope they've worked out that almost everyone hates the stock hihat because it simply doesn't work properly. I wish 2box were able to use the roland designed hihat. I guess it's too expensive.

I think the best solution right now is the second option above - tear it apart and build the controller box.

I plan to do this at stage.

Well...that's what I did but frankly.......I used the hat in it's stock form and it functioned  just fine. It just didn't  feel as good to me as the other "rubber" cymbal offerings. The controller itself whether stock or  in modded box form, functions perfectly with the right cymbal stand. ;)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waynec42 on April 22, 2013, 11:12:14 PM
I think that's a bit harsh. It does work properly in terms of producing variable sounds. Some of us, however, don't like the feel - and that's a personal thing. I'm sure there are people who love it.

No seriously, mine doesn't work properly. 2box have confirmed that my is working as expected, which I consider not properly.

What mine does (and I've tested this with another hihat cymbal) is when playing the foot chick, the bow will always trigger with it (Zones 9 and 4 together). It sounds wrong.

So instead of getting the foot chick sound only I get both, and sometimes they don't trigger at the same time. It makes me sound like I'm playing out of time. I know I'm not the most awesome-est drummer around, but I'm not that bad.

2box tried to tell me that part of the bow sound is mixed with the foot chick. I dismantled the hihat and tested this theory. With the circuit board out of the cymbal, I triggered just the foot chick sound manually by moving the magnet as it would move towards the cymbal if mounted normally, and guess what - only the foot chick triggered and I heard a nice foot chick sound with no bow sample.

Anyhow, just putting up with it for the moment until I figure out the best solution.

...also, I don't really have a problem with the feel.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on April 23, 2013, 02:48:51 PM
No seriously, mine doesn't work properly. 2box have confirmed that my is working as expected, which I consider not properly.

What mine does (and I've tested this with another hihat cymbal) is when playing the foot chick, the bow will always trigger with it (Zones 9 and 4 together). It sounds wrong.

So instead of getting the foot chick sound only I get both, and sometimes they don't trigger at the same time. It makes me sound like I'm playing out of time. I know I'm not the most awesome-est drummer around, but I'm not that bad.

2box tried to tell me that part of the bow sound is mixed with the foot chick. I dismantled the hihat and tested this theory. With the circuit board out of the cymbal, I triggered just the foot chick sound manually by moving the magnet as it would move towards the cymbal if mounted normally, and guess what - only the foot chick triggered and I heard a nice foot chick sound with no bow sample.

Anyhow, just putting up with it for the moment until I figure out the best solution.

...also, I don't really have a problem with the feel.

Well...after this comment...I totally agree. Since you took it apart and tested it and  it solved your issue.......Build a box from the stock parts and get an different cymbal to use as the hat. Sounds like your only solution.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on April 25, 2013, 01:07:19 PM
No seriously, mine doesn't work properly. 2box have confirmed that my is working as expected, which I consider not properly.

What mine does (and I've tested this with another hihat cymbal) is when playing the foot chick, the bow will always trigger with it (Zones 9 and 4 together). It sounds wrong.

So instead of getting the foot chick sound only I get both, and sometimes they don't trigger at the same time. It makes me sound like I'm playing out of time. I know I'm not the most awesome-est drummer around, but I'm not that bad.

2box tried to tell me that part of the bow sound is mixed with the foot chick. I dismantled the hihat and tested this theory. With the circuit board out of the cymbal, I triggered just the foot chick sound manually by moving the magnet as it would move towards the cymbal if mounted normally, and guess what - only the foot chick triggered and I heard a nice foot chick sound with no bow sample.

Anyhow, just putting up with it for the moment until I figure out the best solution.

...also, I don't really have a problem with the feel.
play a bit with the settings. it is all about threshold. your hi hat is fine. had the same issue and solved it by experimenting with settings...
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waynec42 on April 26, 2013, 07:28:49 AM
play a bit with the settings. it is all about threshold. your hi hat is fine. had the same issue and solved it by experimenting with settings...

hmmmm.....in the time that I've had it, I've played quite a bit with the settings. Do you mean the hihat settings rather than the HPED settings? I find that if I find a threshold that works then it makes the hihat not sensitive enough so I get alot of hits on the bow that don't trigger - pretty much every '&' note played (as in eighth notes - 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & etc...) since they are generally a lower velocity.

I'll have another go tonight since you made the suggestion anyhow. You never know.

Maybe you can let me know all your settings for both hihat and HPED.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: BURNIN AMBITION on April 26, 2013, 11:05:43 PM
yes i meant hi hat settings. threshold. when i was troubled like you, i tried to find the best settings taht would allow me to have all my hits registered, without trigerring accidental foot chicks.it took some experimenting but i did it
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: waynec42 on April 28, 2013, 03:37:38 AM
yes i meant hi hat settings. threshold. when i was troubled like you, i tried to find the best settings taht would allow me to have all my hits registered, without trigerring accidental foot chicks.it took some experimenting but i did it

So, I've had another go with the settings.

With the hihat threshold at -12 ( the highest setting) I can still make the bow (Zone 4) trigger by playing the foot chick although they are reduced. Apart from that, my played ghost notes on the bow aren't heard at that threshold.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: peanutismint on October 22, 2014, 05:12:42 PM
Just read this entire thread (all 13 pages!) to see the story unfold and wanted to share my situation.

I have a Roland kit with a Hart ECymbal II hi hat, and have just bought a 2Box module so now need to either buy a convertor like Manfred/Jman make, or make my own, or if my hi hat isn't compatible buy another one and a convertor box, or use a 2Box hi hat, but then I'd need a hi hat stand...

So many options! But unsure which is best... I love the 'real' feel of my Hart Dynamics eCymbal, but worried it's not compatible. Also when I think about making my own convertor box, I've seen plenty of schematics but not 100% sure how to read them, and also seen plenty of pics of the PCB, but wouldn't have the means to create one so it'd be on a breadboard or just components wired together (which I'm also unsure how to re-create from the schematics...).

Any advice from anybody would be appreciated. Just wanted to let you guys know that it's 2014 and people are still trying to use their own hihats with the 2Box module! :-)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: hemiboy on October 23, 2014, 12:26:40 AM
Go with jman by personal message here and or contact him on his website stealthdrums.com . He will guide you the best! I have all his triggers for my  cymbals and drums and hats and all work flawlessly
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: peanutismint on October 23, 2014, 09:39:00 AM
Hey man, thanks. I've already been in touch with the great Jman but he's asking like £80 for this tiny little box and I could buy the official 2Box hi hats for like £150...! So I think I'm just gonna do that. If it was like £20 maybe I'd consider it....
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: mrallgood101 on October 23, 2014, 11:01:56 AM
Just like "peanutismint" did..... I too have Roland pads (PD-125), and have also read ALL 13 pages in this thread!

I think I'm gonna tryout Jman's hi-hat fix. I've been emailing back & forth with him the past couple days (i think he might be a little tired of hearing from me lol), and personally I'm ok with the price....as long as it works. Plus i like the idea of using actual hi-hat cymbals converted to e-drums. I'm just concerned if Jman one day does like Manfred had to do....and stopped making that hi-hat kit!

This is why I've been torn between getting Jman's hi-hat and Ride cymbal conversion (which I think are both genius!).... or.... purchase the Roland TD-11 predominately for my cymbals and hi-hat (VH-12). And I would use the 2Box for ALL drums (snare, toms, Kick...and maybe one cymbal). I think this is a better option than getting Zlidjian Gen16. Man... I am so still confused. ESPECIALLY after reading this whole 13 page thread and sensing Manfred's frustration for lack of pre-orders after ALL that hard work he put in. Oh yea, I'm still torn.

How did things work out for you hemiboy? I remember when you was torn between getting Roland or 2Box? How's the Jman hi-hat working out? Is it close to when you used the Roland hi hat?
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: peanutismint on October 23, 2014, 11:35:08 AM
Haha yeah I think he got tired of hearing from me too...!! But he seems like a really clever guy. The price wouldn't be a huge issue with me but seeing as my beloved eCymbal II is apparently only single-zone (I think) I'd probably end up buying a new hi hat trigger anyway, so it kinda makes better financial sense to give the official 2Box one a try.... I've just ordered one so I'll let you know how it goes.

I know what you mean about getting concerned that these conversion kits might stop being made... I've seen photos of the PCBs and schematics of how they work, but little on the subject of how to actually make one yourself (assuming most people, like myself, don't have access to PCB printing facilities...!!). I think a better option would be for Manfred/Jman to have printed like 50 boards and then sold them as kits (with or without components) for people to solder themselves. I'd be quite happy to do that.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on October 23, 2014, 04:44:27 PM
I made mine by gutting the 2Box hat and building my own version because I am not fond of rubber cymbals no matter what brand. This was after Manfred gave up on producing the boards and before Jman started building his. Lots of work dissecting the hat with those little wires. Now I can use any cymbal trigger from any brand for my hats with my 2Box modules and it works superbly. I've used it with A2E triggers, Yamaha 135, Roland CY14, converted Gen16s, and even modified a VH13 to blend tones from the 2Box and the TD-30. That said....if I had to do it again...I would simply buy it from Jman. In fact that is the plan for my next module's arrival. ;)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: hemiboy on October 23, 2014, 05:22:17 PM
Yeah went for 2 box and Jman and never looked back at Roland again!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: mrallgood101 on October 26, 2014, 08:27:46 PM
Peanutismint - hey bro, definitely let me know how that 2Box hi-hat works out when it arrives. I gotta to test one out at Sam Ash here in NY. They have like 6 full kits (Roland, Yamaha, 2box) on display to sample, and the 2Box hi-hat felt a little strange. It felt like it was a little late when opening & closing. But then again....that was the floor model, and I'm sure the settings and the hi hat itself probably been through world War 5 in that store with the tons of e-drum testing customers! Plus I think that I'm learning that I'm a little more like fulrmr when it comes to rubber hi-hats and cymbals. But I still wanna know how that 2box hi-hat works out for you!

fulrmr - Do you have a video of some sort on youtube of that hi-hat? I think at some point I'm gonna give Jman's hi hat a shot, but I was asking Jman if he had a video of his 2box hi-hat conversion in detail on youtube. he siad he only has the one where he's playing on it. Is your hi-hat still going strong? What would you say are the pros 7 the cons on your current hi-hat? I dunno... so far I'm leaning towards the acoustic hi-hat with this simple hi-hat mic-holder contraption I seen on Zzounds.com

hemiboy - Whoa! That is a strong convincing statement from a former Roland owner. I like that!How is your hi-hat working for you? And do you have the whole 2Box kit, or just the module? When I tried the pads, I told this guy (waiting to play the 2Box) the pads don't feel right. He look at me and said, "Oh really? You think something is wroing with the pads? Hmmm...the pads huh?" Then he got behind that damn 2Box kit and it sounded like Omar, Buddy Rich and Neil Peart had entered the building!! When he finished, he smiled, handed me the sticks and said, "There's nothing wrong with those pads" I smiled  and walked to another part of the store feeling 8 inches tall!! Lol

Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: hemiboy on October 27, 2014, 03:12:19 AM
I have the module only and converted my ludwigs with meshes, triggers and real cymbals,dampened and triggered ala J man, from stealthdrums.com. 
 All  trigger perfectly, never a hiccup for 2 years almost. I hear on this  forum that the pads are great! Ask Murgen, he swears by them. If I wanted an e kit , I would look at a Pintech Phoenix snare,  and their ConcertCast toms on a Gibraltar rack. By the way, I use Jman's Conversion kit on my hi hat and it's the best!
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on October 27, 2014, 05:30:54 PM
Nope...no vid. Just detailed walk throughs of all my DIY builds at vdrumsforum.com. My conversion still works just fine although I have since switched to Gen16s Because nothing beats the feel of "real" hats. ;) That said...if you go with traditional hats....you should check out the Direct Source pickups from Gen16 instead of a traditional mic setup. With these there will be no feedback....ever. Folks have had great success using these for "A" cymbals.

Also...there are many of us here that are previous Roland fanboys...until the 2Box emerged. I myself had the TD-30 and the 2Box side by side for a year....and we all know who won. :)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: mrallgood101 on October 30, 2014, 12:28:21 AM
Man, lemme tell ya, when I'm confused about what to buy or do (which is often these days!) in regards to putting this e-kit together, you guys respond with great useful insight rom your personal experiences.... which is why I LOVE this forum.

Wow... So fulrmr, just like Jman, you had the TD30 side by side and it still wasn't winning over the 2box. That's inspiring to hear!I also agree about the feel of a real hi-hat and a real ride. But Jman's conversion kits are with real cymbals. What made you turn to the Gen16 hi hat? Also... are you happy with the sound and performance of the Gen16? I keep hearing mixed reviews. And on YouTube sometimes they sound thin, and sometimes they sound good. So I really don't know. What's your take on it?

hemiboy... you definitely got me curious about Jman's hi-hat. I'm gonna definitely try out his Ride cymbal 3zone trigger on a Sabian Crash Ride that I have. And oh, the 2box pads triggered GREAT.... it was just I who sucked on'em.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: fulrmr on October 30, 2014, 05:23:04 PM
Jman's kits are great! I've used them for quite a few years(and built a few of my own) with Sabian B8s and I have even converted some of the less impressive Nickel Gen16s that I was not pleased with the tones even after using the Access Tool to tweak them. I trigger samples from the 2Box with these.

That said....the Gen's can be very useful especially the hats, which in my opinion are the shining star of the whole system. Well...those and the DS pickups. ;) This combination of the hats/DS pickup are what sold me me on this system. However mastering the Access Tool is the key to this system for producing tones tailored to one's individual liking.(and we all have very different tastes)

Mixed reviews tend to stem from preconceived expectations that these will sound exactly like your favorite traditional cymbals straight out of the box. Truth is (with the Nickel especially) these are fantastic effects cymbals with unique tones all their own with endless potential for tailoring tones that could very well mimic traditional A's...if you invest the time tweaking. The Bronze coating on the new BB have a warmer base tone which seemingly makes this process a bit easier.

If you go this route...I suggest getting the Buffed Bronze  series, as even all the vids and reviews praise their dominance over the Nickel series for depth and warmth.  Plus they look a bit more "traditional" too. :)

Don't get confused. There is a multitude of great gear out there. Just be patient....do your homework, figure out what you want out of your kit and stick with it, set a budget and buy accordingly. Once you do this there should be no need for "buyer's remorse" or looking back because will you have then accomplished the goal you set out to achieve. After that...set another goal and keep moving forward. :) It's all a continuing, ever evolving  process that will probly never completely end....so take small bites so you don't choke. ;)
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: mrallgood101 on October 31, 2014, 05:02:13 PM
I hear u, fulrmr! Thanks for the insight. You are sooooo right.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Sharkuel on January 08, 2015, 12:27:44 PM
Hey People.

Using a Y cable splitter, does it work? I am thinking of making a design inside my Cymbal, but inverted (magnet on top, board bellow). Using a Male TRS split to two TRS outputs, either male or female, doesn't cut it? I mean, duplicating the stereo signal, if i make myself clear. lol

My idea was one TRS tip (or one stereo cable, if the splitter is female) handle the piezo/swich, and the other TRS handle the open/close values. In my head it kinda works, but if someone already tried, it would be awesome to have such input.

I am comfortable to do some basic soldering, but solder a circuit board i am afraid i destroy the thing.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Jman on January 08, 2015, 03:14:44 PM
Hey People.

Using a Y cable splitter, does it work? I am thinking of making a design inside my Cymbal, but inverted (magnet on top, board bellow). Using a Male TRS split to two TRS outputs, either male or female, doesn't cut it? I mean, duplicating the stereo signal, if i make myself clear. lol

My idea was one TRS tip (or one stereo cable, if the splitter is female) handle the piezo/swich, and the other TRS handle the open/close values. In my head it kinda works, but if someone already tried, it would be awesome to have such input.

I am comfortable to do some basic soldering, but solder a circuit board i am afraid i destroy the thing.
I think I understand what you are wanting to do. Here is an old thread where I removed the control board from a 2Box HH and used it for my own HH cymbal. I did use a stereo headphone type splitter from the box to the module and to the cymbal and that worked. I did not mount mine inside cymbals, but the thread might give you the idea:
http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,722.0.html

I simply clipped each wire of the 2Box cymbal control board in the middle, making a note of how it was wired in the 2Box cymbal and labeling the 2Box cymbal wires for easy reconnection later. I used that 2Box PCB in my own box. Later, after I started using the Manfred board I put the 2Box HH cymbal back together by splicing/soldering the wires back together with shrink wrap covering the tiny solder connections. And the 2Box cymbal worked like new.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Sharkuel on January 08, 2015, 04:31:56 PM
Jman, well that makes me more happy.

I am trying stuff, essencially. My idea is to use it with a dropclutch. I have one, and i want to use it. Under the pedal i read here that is the best route to go, but no drop clutch is possible (at least that is cheap).

And since the board suffers with the constant vibration on the original design, i think i can minimize the vibrations if i put the board on the cymbal underneath.

All for cience.  :patbat2box:
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Sevenchaos on January 22, 2018, 08:21:54 AM
Thanks Jman for the info!
I was just looking info if i can modify 2box own hihat and your thread just popped up  :rock:
Now i need to wait it to arrive, then do some soldering.
I was thinking that i probably use old single kick pedal, take beater off and use that as hihat control pedal.
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: mday on January 26, 2018, 02:52:24 PM
I was thinking that i probably use old single kick pedal, take beater off and use that as hihat control pedal.
That's what I did.

http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,2490.msg21319.html#new
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Sevenchaos on January 26, 2018, 07:18:01 PM
Looks great man! Thanks for the link too.
Is it demon chain? Im just going to use ludwigs kick pedal that i dont use and keep my eliminators together  :)

That's what I did.

http://www.2box-forum.com/index.php/topic,2490.msg21319.html#new
Title: Re: Hihat with other brand cymbals
Post by: Sevenchaos on January 28, 2018, 07:50:53 PM
Finally got it done. Got 2box hat on friday but i was working on friday and saturday, so i didnt have time to do it until today.
So i just opened hihats connector box, cleaned it, did few tests with magnets, soldered few cables and assembly it to a box. Works like a dream.
I did put some little piece of foam under the magnet ,since i never play hats ”dead” closed, but if i want to i can just push the pedal all the way down.
One good thing on that cheap ludwigs kick pedal is that you can snap chain of so easily. So its fast as opening hats screw to drop it down. You just do it on the floor  ;D
Here are few photos of it

(https://thumb.ibb.co/geezYb/33_E44876_8844_4_D76_8359_0_D05_B0964_B75.jpg) (https://ibb.co/geezYb) (https://thumb.ibb.co/n7cmDb/39_A29_AC3_BAED_45_E8_A0_C6_7_DCD44_EDA717.jpg) (https://ibb.co/n7cmDb) (https://thumb.ibb.co/c2WPzG/64_E5_DD48_EF84_429_D_957_F_935_FC9_F67_E65.jpg) (https://ibb.co/c2WPzG) (https://thumb.ibb.co/cE6reG/3_A1_AB7_D5_3_C12_40_E8_B8_C3_70331041_B8_C9.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cE6reG)