So 2Box says the Mk II will take up to a 64gb SD card. However I don't see any recommendations for cards which are compatible, only 32 and smaller. Has anyone tested this yet? If one of the working 32gb cards has a 64gb version with otherwise identical specs, is it safe to assume that this will work?
hey on air again here )))
Same here no success with 64GB after alot format tries(
best i got was getting it work to boot the os but then didnt read the Kits says unaligned_cluster
it is a 64GB Sandisk extreme pro 170mb/s
will try other cards soon
Don't forget to format the card in fat32 format. (Most 64 GB is formatted in ExFAT as standard)
Best regards
Anders/ www.Zourman.com
i did Fat 32 but still unaligned cluster message was written in display after boot the os before reading the kits
Did you had success Zourman)?
https://www.dropbox.com/s/c1xu6q7gjrwvduj/64GBWorking.jpg?dl=0
after alot work and trying i can confirm 64GB working on 2Box5mk2
That's nice!
So You did use the 64GB Sandisk extreme pro and got it working? Have you played with it for a couple of hours with the implementation? The sound glitches will probably show up after a couple of hours of playing.
And please just update for the forum where the blocker was in your case to get it going.
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
After a long time trying i got it to work on 64GB )
i think it will work on all normal cards 64GB as i guess
i run it under a
ProGrade 64GB 250MB7s SDXc V60 2 10 and also
SunDisk Extreme Pro 64GB 170MB/s sdxc V30 3 10
and feels like the 32GB behaviour in playing didnt see any difference
i will tell you the solution i found
the way is to clone your working 32GB card from your Module and write an image of it to PC
then take a 64 GB card and write that image on it ( you dont have to format anything)
The prog i used working here is :
Win32 Disk Imager here to be found https://sourceforge.net/projects/win32diskimager/
then you can try if it works already
but at that step it behaves as 32GB
then if it works you enlarge the patition to full 64GB and voila )
To enlarge to 64GB use the Program Minitool Partition Wizard
here to be found https://www.minitool.com/backup/shadowmaker-pro.html?from-pw-pop
Both Programs are freeware for our use in that term
In the partition wizard you load the 64GB card
it has 2 partitions one 32 GB with your image on it and behind unused space
now simply extend the partition with that prog to full size of the card and
there you should go
BTW i tested on extender with old 2Box drumit five and it also reads it,
couldnt tes it cause it is not connected to drumset
you can also try it on drumit 3 i guess strongly it will work
give it a try nothing to loose)
a sad thing is to say that all support of 2Box regarding this issue not reading 64GB didnt happen
they didnt answer help or give a solution or even tell that it will be possible
it is the main reason i bought the module for that 64GB feature mentioned fom them
it took me many Days of testing, alot money of buying Cards of diffrent brands and speeds
It should have been the money and time from 2box to spend on that Problem
so i hope it will work on your sides and gives the 2Box Family the Ram it neeeeds)
Interesting, should try that for the MkI. My BFD2 and 3 samples do not fit on one 32 GB. :)
so if this works with 64 gb sdxc cards then it maby works with the sdxc cards 128gb,256gb,512gb,1tb,2tb who knows
we need to try this out...
Roel, I am in the states. What brand 64 gb card works and where did you purchase if you don't mind me asking?
Quote from: Stoked2 on December 18, 2020, 08:31:47 PM
Roel, I am in the states. What brand 64 gb card works and where did you purchase if you don't mind me asking?
I don't have a 64 gb sdxc card, I still using the 32 gb sdhc card with the extender mod.
But I'am gonna order a 128 gb sdxc card soon and gonna try it it works with my 2box Drumit 3 module.
this is the PNY 128GB sdxc card then I order:
https://www.cameranu.nl/nl/p3139686/pny-elite-performance-128gb-sdxc-class-10-u3-100mb-s-geheugenkaart
For now I using a 32GB PNY sdhc card 100mb/s and I never run into problems with that card.
So I'am curious that bigger PNY Cards will work, offcourse we must format the new cards to FAT32 to get it work.
but it will be great if those card will work too....
Roel, please let us know how the 2
128 gig card works ?
Quote from: Stoked2 on December 20, 2020, 11:10:14 PM
Roel, please let us know how the 2
128 gig card works ?
I have the 128GB card now, and this week I go to try to make it work,let you guys know!
Thanks Roel
128 GB or 256 GB didnt work with my solution i was trying it promt after get success with 64GB an i still use 64GB without slowdown or any errors
what works with bigger cards is to seize then down to 64 GB what makes no sense even you only have bigger card then 64GB
Interresting for me would be if someone was always successful with my solution
seems not much interrest in that doubble up memory
Quote from: jojo34 on December 23, 2020, 08:15:13 AM
128 GB or 256 GB didnt work with my solution i was trying it promt after get success with 64GB an i still use 64GB without slowdown or any errors
what works with bigger cards is to seize then down to 64 GB what makes no sense even you only have bigger card then 64GB
Interresting for me would be if someone was always successful with my solution
seems not much interrest in that doubble up memory
I will try tomorrow, hope it works my way.let's do it!!!!
Hi!
As I might been indicating above in a post...I don't think the Drumits can address more memory than 64GB...(But I need to verify this with reliable sources)
But - without testing...you never know! Good tests!
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Ive tested it but damn it doesn't work I tried everything to get it work,but no succes.
can i format my 128gb to 64gb or how can I do that?
A good tool when trying format / partition things on a SD card - is https://www.partitionwizard.com/feedback/install-partition-wizard.html?from-demo-v12
Best Regards
Anders / www.zourman.com
Quote from: ANGR77 on December 23, 2020, 09:35:28 PM
A good tool when trying format / partition things on a SD card - is https://www.partitionwizard.com/feedback/install-partition-wizard.html?from-demo-v12
Best Regards
Anders / www.zourman.com
i wil get my money back I will send the 128gb card retour, now the question if i buy a 64 gb sdxc card and i format it to fat32
does it 100% work with my 2box drumit 3 module?
So 64 GB will be the maximum for 2box well I think its enough to handle my kits.
What kind of errors did you get with the 128 GB card? Unallocated clusters?
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Quote from: ANGR77 on December 24, 2020, 08:41:58 AM
What kind of errors did you get with the 128 GB card? Unallocated clusters?
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
The module dit not start, was loading all the time but didden't start up.
but I think you can do it Anders 8)
At least you can give it a try, maby some smart person can do
It.
I got a 64 gb card now formatted it to fat32, and it says unaligned cluster getting desperate now...
I need help please...
hey roel
just try to follow my advice with exact that programs i mentioned
or otherwise you wont succed cause the modul dont support 64GB cards i guess
till now
only works with that way i gave at page 1 of this theme
Quote from: jojo34 on December 29, 2020, 08:07:44 AM
hey roel
just try to follow my advice with exact that programs i mentioned
or otherwise you wont succed cause the modul dont support 64GB cards i guess
till now
only works with that way i gave at page 1 of this theme
Before I begin with your solution, do I have to format the 64 gb card to fat32? or let it in original mode exfat?
No, not needed, the image app described in step 1 in Jojo34s excellent description, makes a copy of an existing working 32GB card (which is fat32 formatted)
This stored image will then in the next step be written cluster by cluster to the 64GB card ... which also through this also will include the FAT32 formatting.
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
I must also add that after been studying jojo34 excellent findings how to get 64GB card running, I can just confirm that it works as a charm...
I used a 64 GB card from Sandisk Ultra 120MB/s...(SDXC card class 10) - which there was no way in hell to get it to work by just using plain fat32 formatting and then copy all 2box files. This only made the card to boot forever or displaying the message unaligned clusters.
But doing the steps described by jojo34...it actually started to work. :-) No glitches or strange things yet regarding the new 64 GB card when running it in 2box. I will now add more samples to my card and see what is happening. (I had 26GB on my original card...I will now move above 50 GB...)
I am guessing that taking Jojo34 route of preparing the card makes a SDXC to behave like a SDHC...(and handle the SDXC erase block boundaries in the right way)
So big Kudos to Jojo34!
(https://zourman.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/img_0060.jpg)
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Hi guys wanted to let you know that my 64 GB Card does work with a 2box Drumit 3!
Man oh man I needed to be very patient with this... was working on a old windows pc at my parents home.
But after a while it was finally ready! and it work perfect!
The card that I use is a PNY 64GB Elite Performance 100mb/s.
I want to thank Mr. Jojo34 (Mag) for his work and helping me true the process.
I'am very happy guys! 64 GB is perfect for me!
Again its a shame for the lame 2box support on this issue.
ha oh yeah
ANGR77 and Roel that makes me happy you are first persons it works i know now ))))
But I think we are a bit lucky here...64 GB is probably the maximum size that you can address in DrumIt...and that we really are pushing the limits here. :-)
So keep looking for sound hiccups and glitches...when using these cards...but I must say it looks promising after been drumming for 2 hours.
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Anders , I have the drumit5 mk2. I think you might have one as well. If so what 64 gig card works with the newest 2 box drumit 5 mk2. Thanks in Advance, Jeff(Stoked2)
The 64 GB card which is on the picture in previous post, worked in my MKII. But I think I need to run it for some days before really accepting that it works flawlessly. :-)
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Quote from: ANGR77 on December 29, 2020, 06:10:50 PM
The 64 GB card on the picture in previous post worked in my MKII. But I think I need to run it for some days before really accepting that it works flawlessly. :-)
Anders / www.Zourman.com
We are gonna test our Cards for sure.
Somebody has to do it because 2box is not gonna do it for us...
Thanks Anders. Keep me posted please and Happy New Year brother!
Best Friends.
Tested with a 128 GB SDXC Card from Kingston with Jojo34s new findings - so here comes my 2 cents:
Performing all outlined steps in the 64 GB approach described by Jojo34 - but instead in this case use a 128 GB card, extend the partition to include the whole SDXC card - e.g. 128 GB. This will however leave you with the disappointing result that the Drumit will just try to boot forever. :(
Ok - some more tests:
- Setting the partition size below 60GB - WORKS! Good thing are that you can use a 128GB card - even if you are only using 50% of it... :D
- Setting it above 60GB - and Drumit will try to boot the OS forever... :(
So the conclusion is - around 60GB is the maximum which all Drumits can address. (A normal 64GB card will probably leave you with a partition size on around 58 GB). Based on the fairly advanced process to generate a working SDXC card - I think we can estimate that 2box never will officially be supporting 64GB. (But I can be wrong here - 8) )
But we have a nice workaround - and it is actually quite hard to fill up all 60GB with dsnd files...! ???
Best Regards
Anders / www.zourman.com
Quote from: ANGR77 on December 30, 2020, 03:12:59 PM
Best Friends.
Tested with a 128 GB SDXC Card from Kingston with Jojo34s new findings - so here comes my 2 cents:
Performing all outlined steps in the 64 GB approach described by Jojo34 - but instead in this case use a 128 GB card, extend the partition to include the whole SDXC card - e.g. 128 GB. This will however leave you with the disappointing result that the Drumit will just try to boot forever. :(
Ok - some more tests:
- Setting the partition size below 60GB - WORKS! Good thing are that you can use a 128GB card - even if you are only using 50% of it... :D
- Setting it above 60GB - and Drumit will try to boot the OS forever... :(
So the conclusion is - around 60GB is the maximum which all Drumits can address. (A normal 64GB card will probably leave you with a partition size on around 58 GB). Based on the fairly advanced process to generate a working SDXC card - I think we can estimate that 2box never will officially be supporting 64GB. (But I can be wrong here - 8) )
But we have a nice workaround - and it is actually quite hard to fill up all 60GB with dsnd files...! ???
Best Regards
Anders / www.zourman.com
Thanx for trying out Anders👍 So 64 GB is the maximum.
I'am happy with it! And I'am happy with this 2box forum.
Now that Jerry is gone ( R.I.P brother )we have to figure things out ourself.
But with the help from each other we can do achieve things!💪
super you worked out the 64GB way)
i confirm same behaviour here as i was testing cards bigger than 64 GB was not successful till now
but 64GB is a dream)
I'm going to order a 64 GB card today or tomorrow and test this as well. Awesome to see it working for everyone, this is so much better than switching cards in and out.
hey 2boxer
i recomment the 64GB solution to good old drumit5 (extender or SD inside to change) to drumit3 (extender or SD inside to change) and Drumit5 mk2
have a try and tell me your results nothing to loose
good Luck
I tried my 64 GB with a extension cable (50 cm length) on my Five & Five MKII for a couple of hours without any problems. I will do it also in the near time on my Three.
Best Regards
Anders / www.zourman.com
I followed the instructions and now I have a working 64 SD Card in my drumit 3, it's the Sandisk Extreme Pro, sadly, the latency issue is still there, playing with the envelope helps but then you have drums and cymbals that stop sounding/ringing abruptly, who wants that....
hey edcito
cool it works also for you but did you have the latency issue before ? what is the cause do you have extender
should not be latency in 2box normally i guess
That is strange. I have never heard of a latency issue before, other than using incorrect cards.
Quote from: edcito on January 13, 2021, 09:44:55 AM
I followed the instructions and now I have a working 64 SD Card in my drumit 3, it's the Sandisk Extreme...
Hmm, did the card You copied also show latency issues? To find the right card is maybe still an issue even if moving to 64GB. My Sandisk Ultra 100 mb/s SD card with 50 cm extender cable seems to work fine...and has done it for a week or so...
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Quote from: ANGR77 on January 13, 2021, 07:28:38 PM
Hmm, did the card You copied also show latency issues? To find the right card is maybe still an issue even if moving to 64GB. My Sandisk Ultra 100 mb/s SD card with 50 cm extender cable seems to work fine...and has done it for a week or so...
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Yes, I created the image from the 32gb micro sd card I bought directly from 2box...
edcito thats good to do with that image but should not be the cause of latency try another card also 32GB if available.
i sometimes have stops or latence issues if i made changes in the module while playing and didnt save the changes or if i am still in for example in calibration mode on hihat or if i activated a drum channel by pressing it and change the sounds and play while not saving the kit or the unit changes i made.
but very rar i get that
when pressed save the changes no issues at all after.
i have 2 64 gb cards running like charme (discribed on earlier post)
all my 32 gb cards no issues
do you have the latest firmware on it
Standing on the shoulders of giants, in the case Jogo34.. I got two new 64gb sd cards working in my Drumit3 this morning. Super cool.
Hey Dobly amazing that it works for you thank you for resonance
could you tell us which cards are working for you
even i guess even all of these cards work
just try to get fast ones
I get the feeling that these bigger cards seems to be more forgiving and less sensitive for the latency problems, glitches and hiccups. My 64 Gb cards seems to work fantastic.
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Although i will most likely never fill 64gb with dsnd files but would with drumless wav tracks to play along and practice to I had to try it. I had about 1 hour on it today playing wav files as well with no noticeable latency issues. 👍 Drumit5 MKI.
jojo34.. I am using the SanDisk Ultra 100MB/s XC 10.
Well I tried to get my MicroSD 64GB Samsung EVO Plus working in 2box. Even with my IT expertise I wasn't able to crack the formatting problem after a couple of hours, stopping short of making a Linux bootdisk. So I cloned the original using MiniTool as recommended. Easy, extended to 64GB, works, but inefficient.
Surprisingly while I was testing, one of the default snares on the original MicroSD cracked up really badly. Alarming that my MKII had an audio anomaly that early - I hope it isn't a problem.
The original 2box MicroSD beats the Samsung by about 0.4ms less on average read access - so I am still looking to procure a better 64GB card.
Best bet I found is an WD IX QD334 Industrial microSD (https://www.westerndigital.com/products/commercial-removable-storage/industrial-microsd) 64GB SLC however it has proactive error checking so it could cost some latency. Difficult to discern details at this technical level without sending a few emails.
Worth a punt at £92? 8) It's not that bad considering the higher seq write speed SLCs go for £500+
Most other manufacturers I've researched cap their SLC line ups at 32GB unfortunately.
My 64 GB card ... still works great...
https://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=4865.msg30989#msg30989
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
So I discovered what the audio anomaly is; my speakers peak protection kicking in! ::)
Funny story, I somehow managed to play just below the threshold that it would only cut out when I thought the module was overloaded - of course, it was just loud enough to happen playing 5 stroke tom rolls.
Secondly, due to an incompatibly with my subwoofer (which I am resolving) I hooked up these balanced speakers directly to 2box. Since they were crossed over at 80hz previously - the problem never occurred before!
So I'm putting that new 64GB SLC card on hold since my Samsung EVO 64GB seems to work flawlessly, at least till it comes down in price.
hey Karbon cool to hear it works
as i often mentioned i am convinced it works with nearely every 64GB card with adequate speed no need of expansive cards
haves fun with 64GB )
Are there any new discoveries about other card specifications besides the size? At some point the consensus seemed to be that the read speed should be no more than 80-90 MB/s, but obviously that information is dated now because at least Anders is successfully using a faster card.
I'm experiencing some minor latency with a SD2 kit using a 32 GB SanDisk Ultra 90 MB/s SDHC card (see this thread (https://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=4909.0)). I'm planning to try a 64 GB SanDisk Extreme 150 MB/s SDXC that I spotted at a local supermarket to see if it works better.
My 64 gb card is a sandisk extreme 120mb/s...and have been working fantastic.
It looks like these bigger cards are more forgiving in terms of latency etc to what we have been used to in the past.(but this of course just feeling - not any science behind )
https://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=4865.msg30989#msg30989
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Well, I got the 64 GB SanDisk Extreme that I mentioned earlier and got it working on my DrumIt 3 with the steps described by jojo34, but unfortunately the latency issue is still there. Might be a bit off topic at this point, so I think I'll continue elsewhere.
Hey Halftime,
how do you recieve the sound ? directly from the module in Headphone so no noise canceling or bluetoth or smth like that some headphone have processing inside makes the sound comming late
same on output of module if some device is inbetween or a PC without interface causes latency i use like this with interface and asio drivers
if you experience the latency only by use normal headphone on the module itself i remember if the modue is in status of unsaved kit or setting mostly if a pad is activated to give it a new sound then i have some latency as long as i dont save the changes ... after saving and maybe also reboot the module all works fine btw i also have SanDisk card running extreme pro
Hi jojo34,
I'm using just the module with normal wired headphones and I'm making sure I'm in the basic kit view when playing.
We've been trying to figure this thing out with Lustar but so far it's still a bit of a mystery. I have no problems playing kits consisting of 2Box samples, but this kit exported from Superior Drummer 2 is causing latency even though it's not any bigger than the 2Box kits. Setting decay to less than infinite does not help. Lustar's best guess so far has been that it's the SD card, but we have also been wondering if this might be somehow related to hi-hat settings because Lustar's test kit where the hi-hat bow sound was removed seemed to perform better. The investigation continues.
After struggling to get this done with Mac tools, I gave up and used my Windows 10 VM. Following the instructions as written, it worked the first time. I purchased SanDisk Ultra SDXC UHS-I 64GB cards. No issues booting, nor any audio glitches that I can detect.
One more e-drumming compromise eradicated. ;D
THANK YOU for this great tip.
Reporting here that Kingston Canvas Go! Plus microSDXC 64GB works very well in a 2box Drumit5 MKII.
I had a clue from a replacement card I was given by 2box support.
Basically since 2018, manufacturers have only recently started to realise a number of people aren't using memory cards just to store data, but to use them to install and run apps. A helpful standard was invented called "Application Performance Class Specification" to certify which cards are suitable for this; rated A1 and A2.
Having high input-output access per second isn't the complete picture, however, there is very reasonable link between high read IOPS and low random access latency - which 2box needs to be below 1ms on absolute terms. Quite a few older 64GB SD Cards actually meet the criteria to be certified A1 already from my research, but they were made before the specification came about. A1 requirement is at least 1500 IOPS read. My Kingston Canvas Go! Plus is A2 (at least 4000 IOPS read) The official 2box card is rated A1.
I have 4 microSD cards now; the ones that are rated A1 or above, work without issue. The cards that aren't certified at all, have glitches and lag. My testing tools aren't sophisticated, but they work well enough to reveal the secret is in read latency (at a particular chunk size) and also read consistency - that I'm just going to say it; buying any 64GB card (or even 128GB provided you restrict the partition size) as long as they are A1 or A2 certified, should work in 2box without any issues.
Shopping only for A1 / A2 certified memory cards should be the silver bullet.
Karbonfaiba...Some nice research here!
And you are totally right here also regarding the cards and classes.
Nice work!
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com / delivering 2box SD cards + memory modkits!
That's some valuable information. Thanks for sharing, Karbonfaiba!
I've been struggling with latency when trying to use SD2 exports as I've written before. At the moment, I'm suspecting it's the combination of a not-entirely-optimal memory card and having to use the XTALK and X-TRG settings with my pads. I wonder if this new performance rating could be the key to solving the problem. Maybe I'll try to find one more card and see if it makes a difference.
One thing to note about the A1/A2 classification is that apparently in some cases A2 may not be faster than A1 despite the specifications. I came by this discussion (https://android.stackexchange.com/questions/214545/should-i-get-a1-or-a2-specd-micro-sd-card-for-my-phone) when googling what this is all about. I don't know if it matters with 2Box.
Just so that things wouldn't be too simple :D
I read that too halftime, which is exactly why I punted for an A2 so I had a comparison.
I will post some pictures here later if I can pass the moderation check. There is also uncertainly around when a manufacturer sells MLC or TLC in the same product line as well, as they often switch technology between sizes and don't specify this, annoyingly.
I do have a significant enough sequential write speed boost on the A2 card vs the A1 card, but read access latency is more uniform.
(https://i.ibb.co/NLWjHHF/2box-SDCard-Test1.png)
All cards shown here are formatted working for 2box (32k cluster, 4k align)
Please notice the change in scale for the Unbranded and Samsung EVO+ firstly. Highlighted in red are the issues that cause glitches / lag.
This isn't just the average random access time that A1 and A2 do better at here - I ran this test several times and noticed I could get those spikes far more occasionally with the uncertified cards than I could with both the Kingston, only rarely would those spike up to 0.8ms, whereas the others could spike anywhere from 3 to 10 sec in worst case scenario.
Highlighted in white on the CANVAS Go Plus 64 GB A2 - this grouping of slightly higher access time appeared only with 4k align formatting (just interesting to note, it was more consistent without alignment but that doesn't boot 2box OS)
Both the 32 GB cards also seem to have a common split in access time due to something, which nether of the 64GB cards have.
very cool research Karbon ty for that
Ah well, still no silver bullet for me with the Kingston Canvas Go Plus 64 GB A2. Latency persists with the SD2 export kit.
Quote from: halftime on April 30, 2021, 03:18:19 PM
Ah well, still no silver bullet for me with the Kingston Canvas Go Plus 64 GB A2. Latency persists with the SD2 export kit.
I think we have discussed this before somewhere...the SD2 issue and the experienced latency or that particular sounds seems to eat up all system resources are related to something else than the memory card.
Here's what you can try to solve latency: (if you have not seen it previously)
- try changing the Decay from "infinite" to 10 for all pieces in your kit, it was found to help a lot.
- try setting "Max tune up" to 4 in SDSE Options > Convert to get smaller dsnd files.
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Quote from: ANGR77 on April 30, 2021, 06:37:39 PM
I think we have discussed this before somewhere...the SD2 issue and the experienced latency or that particular sounds seems to eat up all system resources are related to something else than the memory card.
Here's what you can try to solve latency: (if you have not seen it previously)
- try changing the Decay from "infinite" to 10 for all pieces in your kit, it was found to help a lot.
- try setting "Max tune up" to 4 in SDSE Options > Convert to get smaller dsnd files.
Yeah... we tried all of this with Lustar, but we were unable to solve the problem completely. The set becomes playable with shortened samples and max tune +4, but at that point the cymbal samples are so short that it sounds unnatural.
One suggestion was that the XTALK/X-TRG settings contribute to the glitching and I have to use X-TRG with my PD-85 pads to prevent x-talk between the head and the rim. However, the glitching persists even if I unplug the toms, so I don't know if that can be the issue.
The search continues.
for me the search was over 1 year ago after the drumit5 mk2 release, after many sleepless nights and trying everything, an SD3 Kit from Death and Darkness simply wasn't playable, sorry but if you want to play SD2, EZD2, BFD3, SD3 kits you will be disappointed.
It's true the latest OS X-Talk settings have a huge impact on this, if your pads need these settings on you will be disappointed too.
2box reached their Peak, no more to add with that obsolete hardware, 2Box won't move a finger because the stock kits work perfectly without any glitch, any other imported kit is like "import at own risk".
It was fun with 2box, but I moved on to an edrumin and a module from another manufacturer.
Take care.
i was really surprised when i put original card in drumit 3 card slot. Even if i didnt notice lag with samples made from ssd5.5, ad2, sd2, ez2, before i can feel it now. The sound is there, on the spot, with every hit and I must say it wins in playability, compared to better sounding VST samples.
Quote from: edcito on May 01, 2021, 08:09:38 AM
for me the search was over 1 year ago after the drumit5 mk2 release, after many sleepless nights and trying everything, an SD3 Kit from Death and Darkness simply wasn't playable, sorry but if you want to play SD2, EZD2, BFD3, SD3 kits you will be disappointed.
It's true the latest OS X-Talk settings have a huge impact on this, if your pads need these settings on you will be disappointed too.
2box reached their Peak, no more to add with that obsolete hardware, 2Box won't move a finger because the stock kits work perfectly without any glitch, any other imported kit is like "import at own risk".
It was fun with 2box, but I moved on to an edrumin and a module from another manufacturer.
Take care.
Yeah, it doesn't really seem like 2Box is making a lot of innovations at the moment. The DrumIt 3 and 5 Mk2 are basically just tweaked versions of the original module that is already 15 years old or so. It must be a tough business for them though, so I kind of understand if they don't have enough resources for proper R&D.
I've said before that 2Box is a bit like the Linux of e-drums - if you know the internals really well, you can do some great things with it, but on the other hand, an average user might run into some weird problems that are just impossible to solve.
Personally, I can manage with the stock samples and I think they still sound a lot better than my old TD-12. Working VST exports would be a very nice bonus, but I can live without them for now.
Hmmm, I had no idea of the history of problems with custom samples.
If you can find a way to share your problematic DSNDs with me privately (or your DrumIt5MK2.dkit) I would be interested to see if I can experience the same issues on my 2box.
I'm suspecting you have a trigger parameter issue because I went through the same growing pains with 2box as I did with Megadrum. The main lesson from any of these "Linux" modules is; parameters make or break the experience and they give you the freedom to break it!
I don't think any of this is well documented or understood, but once you learn how all edrum modules work, you develop a sense of CPU stress or out of bounds / trigger anomalies robbing CPU cycles. 2box would definitely be susceptible. It's the same principle as the random access memory tester. If you peak once, it stalls.
I've spotted so many things like that on 2box since I got it, I haven't even had the time to write about the issues yet, but you can cause faults with trigger parameters on any module that allows it.
Have you tried disconnecting your hihat pedal? (as that sends the most continuous data) I'm pretty confident in the Kingston Canvas Go Plus 64 GB A2 - so I'm hoping this is a trigger parameter issue. I haven't done any SD2 exports with SDSE yet and the SD3 export I tried of an EZX2 kit wasn't as good as the native EZX2 export for reasons of missing velocity layers, not lag or anything of the sort.
Thanks Karbonfaiba, I'll send you a PM.
Great to see new activity on this matter. I don't think it is unsolvable...the system works great in many scenarios- but these Toontrack exports seems to create something special. As said a good look on the Hihat sounds and Ride is a good start to try finding the error.
Something that have not been tested is to go back to OS 1.22...on the original Drumit Five and try these SDSE exported sounds to see if any lag/latency is produced.
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Yeah a big part of the problem is a lot of the diagnosis has been guesswork, trail and error.
From my testing with halftime, we've improved things somewhat by reducing the input polling (in theory). But it's still very much a fine balancing act with 2box, as it is with Megadrum or eDRUMin. If you have one thing out of bounds, the system halts while the queue of commands is processed. I think triggering issues play an equal part to issues with the memory card.
I hope the next 2box has more headroom for error. The thresholds are very narrow currently. Just playing on the unit screen for example is enough to cause a queue. Once everything that causes a queue is resolved, then you have your perfect drum module.
Yeah, with Karbonfaiba's assistance I got some improvement by setting Mask = 3 on all pads. The glitching now appears mostly when I play a beat with both the ride and the hi-hat involved. If I leave either one out, the latency is barely noticeable.
It does seem like it has to do with the trigger settings after all, but I don't really know what more I can do because all my gains & thresholds are quite moderate IMO and I only use a bit of XTalk/X-Trg on the toms. It's the same if I unplug everything except bass, snare, hi-hat and ride. Maybe one of those pads has something faulty that's sending extra trigger data, I don't know.
I totally agree with Karbonfaiba, hopefully the next generation of 2Box (if they ever get there) is a bit more forgiving.
Aha.
Some improvements. Halftime, What kind of triggers do you use? (I can't see any of this info in the thread - Just as reference for this post).
I think I can recall an issue from the past - have maybe nothing to do with this issue but I would like to mention it any way...I was once using a Cymbal without any edge trigger...but the settings in 2box was set to a Piezo/Switch implementation ...and the result was just some fantastic latency...and glitches...
A future forgiving 2box...or a new OS? We just need to nail the problem! :-)
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Quote from: ANGR77 on May 03, 2021, 04:08:51 PM
Some improvements. Halftime, What kind of triggers do you use? (I can't see any of this info in the thread - Just as reference for this post).
I think I can recall an issue from the past - have maybe nothing to do with this issue but I would like to mention it any way...I was once using a Cymbal without any edge trigger...but the settings in 2box was set to a Piezo/Switch implementation ...and the result was just some fantastic latency...and glitches...
It's all Roland at the moment. KD-85, PDX-12, 2xPD-85, PD-105, VH-10, CY-15R, CY-12R/C, CY-8 + CY-5. I have seen your comment before about invalid trigger type selection causing issues and have tried to select the correct trigger types for each pad, but of course I could have missed something. The types for the minimum set of pads that I tried (bass, snare, HH, ride) are Kick1, PadPP, HiHat and CyPSB respectively.
Following up on my latency issues, not sure if this is the correct thread, but since it was last discussed here... I got a suggestion from forum member edcito that changing the VOICE setting on the KIT/ENV page to "Mono" instead of "Poly" for the bass drum might help with latency. I tried that and indeed noticed again some improvement. It's still not perfect because I still get a little bit of glitching, but it happens less frequently. I'm not entirely sure what the setting does because the manual doesn't explain it in detail, but it doesn't seem to affect the bass drum sound quality in a noticeable way. It may be more significant with other samples though. Anyway, I thought I'd share the information here as well.
Quote from: Karbonfaiba on April 19, 2021, 11:58:18 PM
Reporting here that Kingston Canvas Go! Plus microSDXC 64GB works very well in a 2box Drumit5 MKII.
I had a clue from a replacement card I was given by 2box support.
Basically since 2018, manufacturers have only recently started to realise a number of people aren't using memory cards just to store data, but to use them to install and run apps. A helpful standard was invented called "Application Performance Class Specification" to certify which cards are suitable for this; rated A1 and A2.
Having high input-output access per second isn't the complete picture, however, there is very reasonable link between high read IOPS and low random access latency - which 2box needs to be below 1ms on absolute terms. Quite a few older 64GB SD Cards actually meet the criteria to be certified A1 already from my research, but they were made before the specification came about. A1 requirement is at least 1500 IOPS read. My Kingston Canvas Go! Plus is A2 (at least 4000 IOPS read) The official 2box card is rated A1.
I have 4 microSD cards now; the ones that are rated A1 or above, work without issue. The cards that aren't certified at all, have glitches and lag. My testing tools aren't sophisticated, but they work well enough to reveal the secret is in read latency (at a particular chunk size) and also read consistency - that I'm just going to say it; buying any 64GB card (or even 128GB provided you restrict the partition size) as long as they are A1 or A2 certified, should work in 2box without any issues.
Shopping only for A1 / A2 certified memory cards should be the silver bullet.
Hello everyone, I've been following this thread and have to say many thanks to all who continue to push the boundaries of these modules. Though I did get a 64 GB card from Sandisk Ultra 120MB/s...(SDXC card class 10) to work a few months ago, I've been trying to do the same with the Kingston Canvas Go! Plus micro SDXC 64GB without success. I've a few questions to see if I can find my way on this. I've been though many different scenarios trying to get this up and running but consistently get a FAT ERROR via installation to the module. I'm using a dedicated daw computer running Windows 7 pro and the 2Box Drumit 3. The initial instructions indicate to Clone the working 32GB card first and then Image the Clone. Is this correct? I notice this new micro SDXC card is formatted with exFat-is this the correct initial state of the micro SD SDXC card? Anyway, just another basher playing on the computer! Any help is sincerely appreciated.
Quote from: Cman on June 09, 2021, 08:10:05 PM
The initial instructions indicate to Clone the working 32GB card first and then Image the Clone. Is this correct? I notice this new micro SDXC card is formatted with exFat-is this the correct initial state of the micro SD SDXC card?
You need to create an image file of the original 32GB card and then write that image to the 64GB card as described in this message (https://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=4865.msg30880#msg30880). The image will replace the formatting of the new card, so it doesn't really matter what the initial state of it is, but the end result should be FAT32. After that, you can extend the written partition to the remaining free space on the card.
Quote from: halftime on June 10, 2021, 05:16:32 AM
You need to create an image file of the original 32GB card and then write that image to the 64GB card as described in this message (https://www.2box-forum.com/index.php?topic=4865.msg30880#msg30880). The image will replace the formatting of the new card, so it doesn't really matter what the initial state of it is, but the end result should be FAT32. After that, you can extend the written partition to the remaining free space on the card.
Thanks for the clarification. I did use that message as my guidance but that message does include the wording of both 'clone' and 'image'. Your reply does clear this up and my question regarding the initial formatting of the card. Appreciate your helpful response.
I have running on 64 GB memory since we (or you, Jojo34 :-) ) cracked the code - how to do it! :-)
It is working just perfect on my 2box units.
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
Still a no-go on trying to get the 64gb micro sd card (in an adaptor) to work in the Drumit 3, have tried everything-numerous times- to get it working. Never had a problem with the 64gb regular SD card. No worries, I can use it elsewhere.
FYI, I bought the exact 64GB card and it would not work with my Drumit 5 MK2. Tried several times.
I have no issues with 32GB SanDisk.
Guys, who supplied the 64 gig cards that don't work? Looking to buy some good ones. Could you please share the source of the non working cards with us? T I A
I had the same problem with the 64gb micro SD card-just couldn't get it to work after many tries. No worries, the regular SD card is fine and works well.
Which card 64GB Micro SD cards have you tried - wetnose and cman ?
Best regards
Anders / www.Zourman.com
I only tried the Canvas Go Plus 64GB Micro SD card-which I couldn't get to work after many tries. Is there a card you would recommend? Thanks for your forum contributions ANGR77.
When you say the Canvas Go Plus 64GB Micro SD card didn't work; do you mean the 2box module doesn't boot with it?
Remember that you still need to follow the formatting guidance for any card over 32GB... which is; creating an image of your stock 32GB card, cloning that image to your 64GB card, then extending it's partition up to the 60GB maximum - the 60GB hard limit goes for any 128GB and 256GB SD cards as well.
Yes, that statement is correct, the 2Box Drumit3 will not boot with it. I believe the 2Box screen reads 'FAT ERROR'. As far as following the correct procedure, 15 minuets prior to trying to get the MICRO SD 64gb card to work, I easily cloned an image to a Standard SD Card (64gb) with no problems (I have done this several times). I do use a micro sd card adapter (micro sd to standard sd card) as my desktop only accepts standard sd cards. I have been extending the partition to the maximum though and haven't paid attention to that detail so I may try again with those settings. Thanks for your contributions also Karbonfaiba.
Update: I went back and cloned an image (4gb) to the Micro 64gb Sd Card and this time I didn't extend the partition-just ejected the card and tried it that way in the module. The results were the same: Fat Error! Just an FYI on this.
Do you have a spare 32GB SD card you can use?
What I did is format a 32GB card using the SD Memory Card Formatter here: https://www.sdcard.org/downloads/formatter/
Quick Format, Format Size Adjustment Off, 32K cluster size.
Then I cloned the partition of that 32GB onto the 64GB card with Minitool. I definitely didn't do a full sector clone, as I saved a lot of time (and memory life) just cloning the partition structure. After that finished I dragged just the 2box OS file and config onto in and tried booting.
If that boots, then go back to extend the partition size to 60GB (real size is 57.9 GB)
Test again, if that works, drag the sound libraries over and you're done!
I have not tried this card, but I think the Canvas Go Plus 64GB Micro SD is too fast for the 2box module with its 170mb/# transfer rate specs. There are slower models available from Kingston. Look for cards with transfer rates around 100 mb/s.
I tried what Karbonfaiba suggested but still had the same result-FAT ERROR! I think ANGR77 may be correct regarding this Canvas Go Plus 64GB Micro SD card access time issue. I sincerely appreciate the time and suggestions to you and ANGR77. Much appreciated. I'll try again with another card sometime and report back. It's really not a big deal at this time, but as most things that use SD cards seem to be moving to the Micro SD card vs the regular size SD card, thought going forward it might be a better choice. Thanks again for your time and help.
Hi All.
I think a card can not be too fast. The host determines the transfer rate. See also
https://www.sdcard.org/developers/sd-standard-overview/bus-speed-default-speed-high-speed-uhs-sd-express/
However, access time can maybe be too long, but that does not affect the card being recognized.
Reformatting 64 GB from exfat to fat32 is not that simple. Cloning is not the correct way actually.
Best,
Deve.
Deve,
Thanks for your input and insight-Always great to have one of the originals in the mix here. Is there a different-better way than cloning to accomplish the use of these Micro SD cards? Thanks for all of your contributions to the development of the 2Box module and to this forum-Greatly appreciated.
Quote from: Deve Loper on May 27, 2022, 09:40:37 AM
Hi All.
I think a card can not be too fast. The host determines the transfer rate. See also
https://www.sdcard.org/developers/sd-standard-overview/bus-speed-default-speed-high-speed-uhs-sd-express/
However, access time can maybe be too long, but that does not affect the card being recognized.
Reformatting 64 GB from exfat to fat32 is not that simple. Cloning is not the correct way actually.
Best,
Deve.
Hi Deve, Can you explain this phenomenon where supposedly (because I don't intend to validate!!) connecting the USB port when using a larger than 4GB card will destroy all of the data on the card? Seems a bit crazy!
Cheers!
Ken
Hi. Thanks for the thumbs up Cman!
As fat32 on sdxc is not officially supported, there is no official utility to format them.
I am afraid cloning will have to do, or very low level byte wise tinkering.
Larger than 4 GB over the current DrumIt USB implementation goes wrong indeed (I know why).
However, I dont want to go into details because I need the solution for my own sake, so to say :-)
I hope you understand. It cant be solved with an OS update anyway.
The original DI5 had the card built in, because it is (and turned out to be) hard to find a capable card. So the 4 GB USB limit back then was ok.
All the best,
Deve.
Ps. In the DI5mkII user manual it still says support for 64 GB, but on the web site its gone.
SD Express sure looks tasty doesn't it?
That marriage with PCIe 4.0 and NVMe is ideal. SSD like bandwidth in SD Card form factor is crazy, hopefully IOPS come along for the ride too.
I would have no idea if it would be easier to develop AHCI for MSATA or NVMe for SD Express at this stage. The Mimic uses the former and it fairs perfectly well, but its an expensive module still, any cost savings made on the older SATA interface seems to have been made redundant by it's construction costs. However if both memory storage options provide the performance, I would pick the least troublesome.
Hi. Sure fast these newer SD card interfaces. But it depends on the type of cpu / soc if it can be used.
Best I have seen is UHS-1 on embedded soc chips. (Mmm, interesting! :-)
Mimic uses a Sitara SOM which has SATA,
https://www.compulab.com/products/computer-on-modules/cl-som-am57x-ti-am5728-am5718-system-on-module/#ordering
Just the SOM costs like the whole DI5 mainboard.
Best,
Deve.
Here are my 2cents and preliminary results. (I will elaborate in a future post). I'm a Linux guy and I take a systematic approach to problem solving technology issues. Plus I have a dislike for anything Microsoft, especially where key events happen behind a GUI. So I've taken a foundational approach to troubleshooting this issue. For an OS to initialize and start up, the media, or in this case the SD card, needs to be able to tell the BIOS I have what you need to boot correctly. If not the boot procedure will fail and you will somehow be told the OS did not start and for you to "pound sand". Therefore, it makes perfect sense that simply copying files from the 32GB SD to the 64GB card won't work, even if formatted to fat32. In the original 32GB card, although I haven't checked this, I would hazard a guess that the boot flag is set. This would explain why imaging the 64GB SD with the 32GB image works... because the boot flag was previously set.
With this in mind, this is what I did.
Media: SanDisk Extreme PRO SDXC UHS-I. 64GB, 200MB/s
Procedure: Formatted the entire 64GB partition to fat32, set the Boot bit, and renamed volume to 2Box.
Created filesystem fat32 on partition '/dev/mmcblk0p1'
1st: Delete file system on '/dev/mmcblk0p1'
Command: wipefs --all /dev/mmcblk0p1
2nd:: Create file system 'fat32' on partition '/dev/mmcblk0p1'
Command: mkfs.fat -F32 -I -v /dev/mmcblk0p1
Command: sfdisk --part-type /dev/mmcblk0 1 c
3rd:: Check file system on partition '/dev/mmcblk0p1'
Command: fsck.fat -a -w -v /dev/mmcblk0p1
4th:: Set flags for partition '/dev/mmcblk0p1' to boot;
Command: sfdisk --activate /dev/mmcblk0 1
5th:: Set the file system label on partition '/dev/mmcblk0p1' to 2Box;
Command: fatlabel /dev/mmcblk0p1 2BOX
6th: Extracted the contents of DrumIt5_MK2_CC_Second.zip to the new 64GB 2Box SD card. The ...Second.zip file contains the OS, DrumItOS1.36.3.bin.
7th: Inserted the 64GB card with ONLY the contents of DrumIt5_MK2_CC_Second.zip, hit the power button and.... SUCCESS.
8th: Came back to my laptop, wrote this message while extracting the contents of DrumIt5_MK2_CC_First.zip in the new 2Box 64GB SD card.
9th: Posted this message and I am now on my way to see if everything still works... I'll get back to you soon.
Cheers
Chris
So it works!
I would be interested to see if it can be repeated by anyone else. Look forward to reading more.
Cheers
Chris
Hi Chris. Good job!
DI5 doesnt care about boot flags. Just the 1st partition entry at the end of the 1st sector.
However, sd cards have certain erase block boundaries which should be taken into account for best performance.
I never tested more than 32 GB back in the days, but now I have.
Cheers, Deve.
1st of all, love the imagination with your username.
After posting the information I looked at the 32GB card with GParted and saw that lpa was the only flag. So that left me scratching my head. That said, I left the boot flag and it continues to work without any lag or distortion. I have no issues whatsoever. When I have more time all dd the 64 gig card and try to figure out why this is working so nicely, unless you already know.
Cheers
Chris.
Hi!
As you might have seen in this thread (#6) We solved the issue and made a 64 Gb Sd card to boot and perform well on 2box. (2years ago) - the trick is to populate a 32GB SD card using FAT32 and the just extend the partition- which many partition programs on the market can do. Then you have a perfect working 64 GB system on your 2box. (However, Don't use the USB port after extending the SD card above 4GB)
If people does not want to fiddling around - I am selling pre-configured tested working SD cards and also complete kits with card cable extensions and everything set, installed and loaded for booting on 2box with 64GB - just plug and play!
Best regards
Anders / Zourman.com