I have a Roland PD-120 snare but when I hit the rim any harder than an extremely soft tap it also triggers the main trigger sound from the mesh head.... I've tried changing X-talk settings on the snare and also messing with the trigger level and all sorts of other settings but nothing seems to fix it... Is this due to the way the 2Box interprets my snare? It never used to happen on my TD-8 where the head and rim hits were always completely separate...
Any ideas??
looks like a wiring problem ... maybe both piezo are connected to the head input ...
I doubt it, as I mentioned the rim/head sounds were always completely separate using the same drum on my Roland TD-8...
I have noticed that on certain 'patches' of the 2Box module the effect is slightly less pronounced... Is there a way to edit at what velocities certain samples are played on each input??
Did you try changing the Rim settings? If you press More on the module (keep it pressed) and press the Snare button you can edit the Rim settings for that pad. It also works for toms. You could try increasing the threshold for the Rim.
Hey man, yeah I've tried the rim settings, thanks. First I had the snare X-talk on high and the rim on 'off', but I might've had that mixed up in my brain... So I swapped that around, but still the same issue...
Like I said, it seems to be slightly better on certain kits, but even then it's still a mix of both unless i play REEEAALLY quietly.... I'm wondering if it's to do with the centre-cone trigger on the snare? I've heard people say it's better to use a piezo mounted off to one side of the drum....??
I actually have a spare mesh head (the original Roland one - this one is a Hart Dynamics mesh head) so I could theoretically add a piezo to the other head and mount that, and then somehow combine the two trigger outputs (one for the head, one for the rim...)
Crosstalk should have nothing to do with this. I would put the original head back on and try adjusting the rim threshold again......just to see if the 2ply head makes a difference.
Thanks, I'll give that a try!
Was u ever able to get that PD-120 to work with the 2box module - and sound just as good as if it was a roland module?
I swapped the head and I don't know if it made much difference, but I have found that different kits seem to be more or less susceptible to the problem... Maybe I just need to go through them all and assign a proper 'cross stick' sample to the ring, rather than a 'rim' sample...
As a snare trigger, tho, the PD-120 sounds awesome.
Ok, cool! Peanutismint, you are defintiely addressing my biggest concern...which is... my Roland pads working flawlessly with a 2Box module WITHOUT me having to do any DIY type of stuff.
So your Roland PD-120 pads are all working great with the 2box module? Or is it working great with some kits - and not so good with other kits?
The snare sounds great with everything. My only issues now (having bought a 2Box Hi Hat) is getting my 2-zone Roland cymbal to work properly, and also just tweaking the whole kit a little bit. But yeah, for the most part, Roland stuff seems fine! Maybe not 100% (or as good as a 2Box kit might work) but it definitely works, and it probably feels/plays better than the 2Box stuff would (from what I've heard...)
uh-oh...wait a minute... I always had a feeling that getting the roland hi hat to work with the 2box module might be problematic. That's why I'm going with the acoustic hi hat for now. But when you say your still having a little problem tweaking the whole kit to work with the 2box module....now THAT kinda concerns me!
Well no.... firstly, Roland hi hat won't work with the 2Box module...hence me buying a 2Box one. Also, there's always going to be 'tweaking' required to get a new kit set up. It all works but I'm just wanting to make the best of the settings.
Quote from: mrallgood101 on November 08, 2014, 12:52:42 AM
uh-oh...wait a minute... I always had a feeling that getting the roland hi hat to work with the 2box module might be problematic. That's why I'm going with the acoustic hi hat for now. But when you say your still having a little problem tweaking the whole kit to work with the 2box module....now THAT kinda concerns me!
When it comes to dialing in ANY module for optimal play, there will ALWAYS be tweaking. Especially when tweaking to your individual playing style and even more so with ANY 3rd party pads. Even with stock pads, most modules are not set up for "optimal" playability.
As for the 2Box HH, most any 2z will work just fine(including the Roland since you already have them) using the control box mod of Jman's and a really good HH stand with adjustable spring.....but as said...you'll still have to spend the time tweaking no matter what. No need to stress over ANY of this. :)
True!
While we're on the subject - I'm finding my hi hat (an official 2Box on a Gibraltar stand) is making a lot of unexpected 'noises'... Like it's difficult to get it to 'chik' without lots of weird missed-notes triggering... IS this a common problem? I've messed with threshold/sensitivity settings etc... still there...!
Hi guyz.
Like peanutismint, I have the same issue and no way to get rid of this head sound when hitting the rim of my PD-105/125 Roland pads.... even by tweaking the Threshold, the xTalk and Curve.......
I really don't think we can get very good results with a 2Box brain and Roland pads (at least PD-125 and PD-105)...... If someone can help, that would be great.....
Otherwise, I so love 2Box module and sounds... and yet I come from a Roland TD-30 (but was bored of the synthetic sounds...). So maybe I would need the original 2Box hardware (not the most sexy IMO but at least is compact and working well with the brain)...
To address the original post concerning the PD-120: If you want to do a simple mod on the PD-120 I would suggest simply moving the piezo from the frame of the Crossbar to the shell of the drum. Here is a picture of a mod I did to a Custom made acrylic style pad I built. It had a Roland PD-100 crossbar system installed ..... This was years ago. I changed this pad from a single zone to dual zone. Simply moving the piezo to the shell should give much better isolation from the head zone for the 2Box module.
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7548/15963059430_7803faf7e9_s.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/qjARqA)PD-100 add-on piezo left side (https://flic.kr/p/qjARqA) by dajmando (https://www.flickr.com/people/119814595@N06/), on Flickr
The Crosstalk setting in the 2Box module is very useful to help with the type of problem described. Unlike the Roland module though that needs quite a bit of crosstalk between the head and rim section of the drums .... a little more isolation between the 2 zones is better with the 2Box module.
As far as settings for the PD-125 I know Allan (Digitaldrummer) has tested that with the 2Box module and may be able to suggest settings ....... Again though more isolation between zones is better for the 2Box module. IMO the basket that makes the PD-125 ideal for the high end Roland modules is not the best design for the 2Box module. Whenever you hit the rim on the PD-125 you are causing quite a bit of vibration to the head piezo/cone because the basket hangs over the drum edge and the head piezo platform is in the same basket. Possibly adding more isolation via rubber washers to the platform stand might be one idea to test if you cannot find the solution via trigger paraemeter settings.
Hey Jman, thanks for posting. This looks like an interesting mod, and reasonably simple to achieve.
Can I ask, though, in the image you've provided it looks like there's a piezo trigger on the shell but also the original 'crossbar' one still installed... Are you saying you installed the piezo in addition to the crossbar? And then did you just swap the wiring from the crossbar trigger to the rim one?
Quote from: peanutismint on January 03, 2015, 10:14:25 PM
Hey Jman, thanks for posting. This looks like an interesting mod, and reasonably simple to achieve.
Can I ask, though, in the image you've provided it looks like there's a piezo trigger on the shell but also the original 'crossbar' one still installed... Are you saying you installed the piezo in addition to the crossbar? And then did you just swap the wiring from the crossbar trigger to the rim one?
That is the top view, so the piezo on the crossbar is the head piezo that has a cone on top. That was a PD-100 trigger/crossbar and the PD-100 has no rim piezo, so I added a rim piezo, (actually I added 2, 1 on the shell at each end of the crossbar). 1 Rim piezo should work fine though with the 2Box module. For the PD-120 it should be simple as gently removing the piezo from the crossbar and sticking it on the shell.
Ah I see, thanks. So I can just remove the head piezo, cone and all, and stick it to the rim with tape or something?
Quote from: peanutismint on January 03, 2015, 10:22:08 PM
Ah I see, thanks. So I can just remove the head piezo, cone and all, and stick it to the rim with tape or something?
No, you don't want to remove the head piezo, leave that one alone. Just move the rim piezo that is stuck to the crossbar near the circuit board in this pic:
(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7502/15566207074_9c6635c33d_s.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/pHwT3A)What's%20Inside%20Roland%20PD120 (https://flic.kr/p/pHwT3A) by dajmando (https://www.flickr.com/people/119814595@N06/), on Flickr
AH yes of course, sorry, it's all coming back to me now. I will give that a go! :-)
Quote from: peanutismint on January 03, 2015, 10:37:30 PM
AH yes of course, sorry, it's all coming back to me now. I will give that a go! :-)
You might have to clip the zip tie if it has one that holds the wire to the crossbar, can't remember if it has one. The main thing is to be very careful taking the piezo off the crossbar as it is very easy to crack the ceramic. My suggestion would be to heat the crossbar. Heat the crossbar on the underside of the piezo, not the top side the piezos are on, just the bottom underneath where the piezo is stuck. If you heat that with a heat gun or hair dryer and then use a razor blade slowly going around the piezo separating it from the crossbar .... you can lift it easily without damage. Then use some double sided tape to stick it to the inside of the drum shell ...... you should see an improvement in rim response.
Thanks, I'll give that a try.
I actually have a spare piezo, so I wonder whether it'd make more sense for me to just mount a second piezo on the rim and then snip the wires going to the 'stock' trigger and cable it into this new one using some sort of terminal block...? That way if it doesn't work or I ever want to go back to the 'stock' trigger I could just swap the old cables back into the terminal block... Does that sound like a good plan?? Or does the piezo used need to be of a specific kind or specification...??
Yes you can do that ...