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other drumming & musical stuff => e-drum DIY / modifications => Topic started by: Manfred on September 09, 2011, 12:01:34 AM

Title: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Manfred on September 09, 2011, 12:01:34 AM
Hello,

last week i bought a Yamaha PCY-155 and would like to share the results of my tests. Out of the box it can be used as a 2-zone crash. With some minor modifications it can also be used as 2-zone ride or hihat. As far as i know the PCY-135 uses the same circuit board. So the following descriptions should also match for that.

General description:

The cymbal has a piezo wired to the tip of the TRS jack. In addition there are 3 switches wired to the ring of the TRS jack. Two to detect edge hits and the third to detect bell hits. The switches at the edge are in parallel and have a series resistor. This resistor is used by Yamaha modules to differentiate between edge and bell. The 2Box module can not detect the difference between bell and edge switches so bell and edge will trigger the same sound. Directly connected to the piezo is a voltage divider (two resistors and a potentiometer) to lower and adjust the output signal.

Schematic:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/PCY155_Schematic.png)

Picture top layer:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/PCY155_top.jpg)

Picture bottom layer:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/PCY155_bottom.jpg)


Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Manfred on September 09, 2011, 12:02:22 AM

Usage as Crash (2 zones bow / edge)

The cymbal can be used out of the box as a crash with 2 zones (bow, edge) and choke. Recommended trigger type is "CyEdg". You can also try "Cym12/14" but these are made for the 2Box cymbals with 3 zones. Depending on the gain setting you might have bell sounds somewhere on the bow when using "Cym12/14". Thats why i recommend to use "CyEdg".

Hits on the bell will also trigger edge sounds. If you don't like that you can simply unplug the connector for the bell switch. Then you will have bow sounds at the bell. Here is a small video using the cymbal as a crash (with disabled bell switch):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKWPqwNBDrs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKWPqwNBDrs)


Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Manfred on September 09, 2011, 12:03:08 AM

Usage as Ride (2 zones bow / bell)

To use the Yamaha cymbal as a ride with bell and bow zones i recommend to set the trigger type to "CyCup". To avoid bell sounds when hitting the edge i also recommend to disable the edge switch. This can be done easily by unplugging both connectors for the edge switches. With this settings you will have a very good differentiation between bow and bell but no choke anymore. Loosing the choke function is the price for having a better differentiation between bow and edge compared with the original 2Box-cymbals. Here is a short video using the Yamaha PCY-155 as a ride:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9t6pc4VQrvw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9t6pc4VQrvw)

Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Manfred on September 09, 2011, 12:04:00 AM
Usage as Hihat

To use the Yamaha cymbal as a Hihat you need an additional circuit board for the level detection. This can be either the original board taken from the 2Box hihat or the adapter board which i posted in the other thread. There is also a small modification at the cymbal required. In order to have both zones at the hihat (bow / edge) you need to bypass resistor R2. This can be done by soldering a wire between the pads of this resistor. Of course a 15" cymbal is pretty large for a hihat but it works also with a PCY-135. This was already tested by espen.

Picture with bypassed resistor R2:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/PCY155_R2.jpg)

And again a short video with a PCY-155 as Hihat (trigger settings not really optimal, i did just a quick setup):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1zYmUzp1eY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1zYmUzp1eY)


Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Manfred on September 09, 2011, 12:04:50 AM
Increasing the output level of the cymbal

If you already have set the output level of the cymbal to maximum but still need (too) high gain settings at your module you can increase the output voltage by bypassing resistor R5. To bypass the resistor you can solder a wire between the 2 pads of this resistor. Afterwards i recommend the following procedure to setup the output level.

- Set potentiometer for output level at cymbal to minimum (marked with "-")
- Connect cymbal to one of the three cymbal inputs
- Switch on module
- Choose trigger type
- Set gain to a low value (something between 0 and 4)
- Play the cymbal and increase output level at cymbal until hard hits trigger full velocity
- If you reach maximum at the cymbal continue by increasing gain at the module if necessary

Thats all!

Picture with bypassed resistor R5:

(http://www.njnj.de/bilder/PCY155_R5.jpg)

Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: GenuineHuman on September 09, 2011, 07:48:37 AM
Cool, thanks.
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: franz-tanz on September 10, 2011, 08:19:07 AM
Hi there,
So what about the YAMAHA RHH-135 HI-HAT E-DRUM PAD,
 Is there any difference if you youse this pad in comparison to the PCY 135 Cymbal Pad used as a hihat?
Maybe its build different?
thanks
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Baby Samus on September 10, 2011, 08:16:58 PM
Hi Manfred, just want to congratulate you on another useful and detailed post, great work.  :patbat2box:
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: rythm on September 11, 2011, 06:43:20 PM
Hi Manfred, just want to congratulate you on another useful and detailed post, great work.  :patbat2box:
+ 1, same here, thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: 3drum on September 16, 2011, 03:33:22 PM
Hey Manfred,
 I'd like to purchase one of your boards for the hihat modification. I have a yamaha pcy135 and will be using it for my hihat. What is the procedure for purchasing them.

            Thanks,

                John
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Nico on August 20, 2012, 09:24:04 PM
Thanks Manfred. Very useful !
Has anyone ever tried to put the bell switch CN3 in parallel with R5 ? Would this make the cymbal 3-zone with cym12/14 setting.
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: pro424 on September 23, 2012, 02:42:07 PM
is there no way to make this a 3-zone cymbal?
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: pro424 on September 27, 2012, 09:22:27 AM
Hm, trying to learn about this stuff. So where is the piezo in this one located?

My thinking: If you disconnect the bell switch, and then relocate the piezo to the bell and use the cymbal with cym12/14 settings, wouldn't that make it work as a 3 zone cymbal?
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Nico on October 26, 2012, 01:23:47 PM
Hm, trying to learn about this stuff. So where is the piezo in this one located?
Piezo is located in the box where connector is.

Quote
My thinking: If you disconnect the bell switch, and then relocate the piezo to the bell and use the cymbal with cym12/14 settings, wouldn't that make it work as a 3 zone cymbal?
2box cymbals are using a ring piezo in the bell so it triggers 360 degree.
If you put a standard piezo in there, you will probably need to hit accurate but in theory it should work.
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: pro424 on January 09, 2013, 11:52:14 AM
hm can i buy a ring piezo somewhere? or maybe put four, or eight regular piezos in a ring?
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: edtc on January 09, 2013, 05:57:11 PM
hm can i buy a ring piezo somewhere? or maybe put four, or eight regular piezos in a ring?

it s quite hard to find those ring piezos ... 

    i ve read that putting too many piezos in a raw will produce a too high voltage , that can damage the module ...  you can try with 2 small 10mm piezos , i ve did it for the edge sensor of my snare , and it works for 2 years now without issue...

and about the 360 degree , you sure wont need it if you prevent the cymbal from spinning ...

so go for 2 or even one piezos facing you in the bell and post the results ....
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: pro424 on January 12, 2013, 03:43:07 PM
Maybe try with like four or eight in a ring and then put a simple 10k or 100k pot after would work?
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: edtc on January 13, 2013, 03:34:52 AM
i dont know , i have very little knowledge in electronic   ... try with one or 2 to begin with    ...IMO i feel that so many sensors is overkill.... who needs to hit all over a cymbal by the way ( if it dont spin...)

is the edge switch present all around  the  .Yamaha PCY-135 ?  because it not only serves for choking , but also for the "crash" zone ... so if the switch dont work all around , it wont be 3 zones at 360...

and as i said , Yamaha PCY-135 have a anti spinning system built in , so as long as you dont run all over the place around your drumkit you should be ok ...
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: pro424 on January 13, 2013, 11:50:14 PM
Just have to buy one then :)
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: revengehorus on May 21, 2013, 03:15:11 PM
Hi,

It is my first time on this forum, I would buy a module 2box but I have yamaha cymbals (pcy-135 and 155), so I'm very interested in this topic and found the following link may help:

http://www.drumlessons.com/drum-forums/topic/7796-diy-modification-of-yamaha-pcy135-and-pcy155-for-roland-kits/

Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: edtc on February 01, 2017, 05:16:26 PM
I had a great deal on 2 PCY135 and a PCY155 ...

I did the simple HH mod  posted here , (real simple and  works great ... )

I use Manfred's HH board ( similar to JMANs HHBOX )

Before , i use to have a Roland CY-5 , and i can tell that PCY135 is much better in term of sensitivity .Triggering is a lot more accurate .

The BOW/EDGE separation is way better too . 

next week , i ll mod the ride .... :drum1:





Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Drumaster on February 02, 2017, 11:49:10 PM
I just bought 2 PCY155 to replace 2 of my 3 2Box 14" (they were way too hot, they 'exploded' to 0dB at each hit even with gain and curve to the lowest).
I use them with 'Cym14' type setting and both bow and edge work like a charm without any bell triggering on the bow, even with hard hits. Strangely, 'CyEdg' does not work that great for me, I have to increase the gain to have a decent response, whereas 0 is fine with 'Cym14' setting.

By the way, I set the cymbal level (physical adjustor behind the cymbal) to the highest.

They really are the best cymbals for me, in term of manufacturing quality, play feeling and price (less than twice cheaper than a CY-15R...).
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Itsme on December 21, 2017, 04:38:47 AM
if you come across PCY 130s and 150s cymbals you can open up the input box and just disconnect the short white connector and adjust the sensitivity up to suit, works perfect as a 3 Zone ride, better than original 👍
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: rafaelfreitas on July 16, 2018, 10:28:30 PM
Hi Itsme (or anyone that can helps  ;D),

I have a 130sc. Which would be the short white connector? Many thanks!
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: rafaelfreitas on July 20, 2018, 06:02:34 PM
I think it's better to send a photo from my pad. The pad is actually the 150S, but the 130SC that I also have has a similar internal shape.

 I've disconnected the smaller one on the top left, but it kind disconnect the triggers. The other two with a blue wire when disconnected didn't work as 3 zones neither.

How did you managed to make them as 3 zones? Thanks a loooot!

Photo:
https://ibb.co/bHX86y

(https://ibb.co/bHX86y)
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: Zappmax on June 22, 2019, 07:27:30 PM
Hi,  i am missing the choke switch im the schematics in the beginning has someone an updated version

Thx
Title: Re: Yamaha PCY-135/PCY-155 and 2Box
Post by: welshsteve on June 24, 2019, 05:40:02 PM
I did a repair using two piezo, one on the top and one opposite the cymbal stand hole. It wasn't as good as the donut piezo they used, but it worked near enough good.