EXPERIENCE WITH DDRUM ACOUSTIC PRO TRIGGERS!

[ginettine]

Hi,
I have just buy a new set of DDRUM acoustic pro triggers ( NOT THE RED SHOTS!), and a couples of mesh heads (rolands-Harts Dynamic- Pearl -Tama).
My intention was to build an acoustic to edrums conversion fo live gigs.
I don't like the visual effect of the 2box rack-pads sistem.
The conclusion of my tests is that the DDRUM ACOUSTIC PRO DON'T WORK properly with the 2Box brain. The voltage level os the DDRUM sensor are too low!
To listen at good level, the gain on the module, is no less of 9 for all inputs!
BADS RESULTS WITH ALL TYPES OF INPUTS (kicks - pads - triggers!)on the module!
Stay away from this type of triggers.
Someone tell me that the DDRUM black triggers are ways better!
I ended to build a cross bar inside the shell, with the cone piezos.
In this way the sistem work (IMHO) better than the 2Box pads.
I have changed the original 2box snare pads, due the impossibility to have a decent rim sound, but with new pads (with 5 o-rings), I have the same problem.
With my diy sistem I have mounted a piezo even on the shell and now I have good rims on all toms and snare!

[edtc]

Amen to that ...

DDRUM triggers works worse than any crappy Diy system ... and for the price of one , you can convert all your drumkit with piezo and foam ...

I found some trick for the rim trigger ... i attached Two small piezo of 10mm to 2 little metal L bar , mounted like the crossbar to a free lug with a simple screw ... place one at 8 o'clock and one at 5 o'clock , just where you hit ... The signal is more powerful than if you mount the piezo to the shell , mostly when it is wood...

have fun...

[edtc]

Here are some pics ...

to make it you will need this....



to do that ...



and stick it like that...



the domino really helps to have a steady connection , it s also easier to exchange the trigger if needed....
dont put foam between the metal bar and the shell in order to have the strongest trigger signal ....

IMO it s better to place two of those guys for a DIY snare drum or tom ... the metal bar can be smaller or have a different shape , i just took what i had ...

/// costs less than 2 euro

have fun...

[logihack]

i will ise this topic for question about external triggers...i have jobeky stealth kit with roland based trigger tehnology - well both uses triggers in the center...i must tell that drums are working well with 2boxes module, but i must have set gain to 0 and of course, triggering is still to hot if i strike drum in the center...
and now i dont know, should i sell the jobeky drums and buy some small acoustic drum set, mesh heads and roland external triggers...i could also use that existing jobeky kit and just move the trigger inside offset, near the rim, but i never done such a thing...i really dont know what will be better...any suggestion?

[edtc]

..i must tell that drums are working well with 2boxes module, but i must have set gain to 0 and of course, triggering is still to hot if i strike drum in the center...
...any suggestion?

HI

you can try to set the pad type to ACTRIG ... i noticed that the gain range is different in this mode , i use it for a " too hot" rubber pad i have... maybe you ll have to tweak the curve too to have a good dynamic...

.... best thing would be that 2box modifies the gain setting so we could have a lower gain setting , as some people asked here for a long time...

[logihack]

hmmmm...now i have set gain to 0, velocity curve is neg1...for me the hot signal is not such a problem like hotspoting is...of course this is somehow similar, but not quite...the best result i get is with velocity curve set at normal, becouse hot spot is bigger than - but i lose dynamic range...i will try it with actrig settings...i really cant play drums not hiting the center 

[Deve Loper]

Hi.
There's nothing the software can do to lower the sensitivity. If a trig signal is too hot it already clipped at the analog to digital stage. So use a series resistor from the pad to the DrumIt. The trig input impedance is about 15 kOhm so 15 kOhm extra in series will reduce the trig level with 6 dB (half the amplitude). To reduce to 1/4 (-12 dB) use 45 kOhm.
Deve.

[Deve Loper]

That was the theory. In practice the transducer (piezo or other) has its own source resistence as well. So easiest is to use a small potentiometer like 47k, bottom end to ground, top end to pad, slider to DrumIt input.
Deve.

[edtc]

thanx  for the info ...but why is the response lower in Actrig mode? or is it just an impression?

[bebycar42]

hello,
The ddrum4 module has specific set up for external triggers, the 2box's engineers are the same guys who created the legendary ddrum, i can't believe that the ddrums triggers don't work well with 2box system... There is certainly a setting for triggers.
Also, the 'black Tdrums triggers are built under ddrum license so, they are exactly the same than ddrum ones.
Yo 

[logihack]

Hi.
There's nothing the software can do to lower the sensitivity. If a trig signal is too hot it already clipped at the analog to digital stage. So use a series resistor from the pad to the DrumIt. The trig input impedance is about 15 kOhm so 15 kOhm extra in series will reduce the trig level with 6 dB (half the amplitude). To reduce to 1/4 (-12 dB) use 45 kOhm.
Deve.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/10-New-Piezo-Transducer-Disc-Pickup-Drum-Trigger-20mm-/180618736484?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item2a0db73364
so if i have 27mm piezos now and i change it with those, will i reduce hot triggering?

[logihack]

im selling my jobeky kit, and i allready chose new acoustic kit(20",14", 10", 12", 14")...i tried how the ddrum pro triggers work(just on one tom) and its much better than my e kit...dynamics works well and triggering is good also...
with jobeky i had gain at 0, but with ddrum trigger at 13...so its in the middle...it was just a quick test, but enough to fell and hear the difference...
but now im confused about triggers...i think i will trigger drums with mylar heads, but i dont know should i buy roland triggers or ddrum...and even if im more on ddrum side, i dont know if the black triggers are better than red ones http://www.ebay.de/itm/ddrum-DRT-Set-/230665114894?pt=Drums_Percussion&hash=item35b4b6550e
i dont have time for DIY now, but latter i will try it

[digitalDrummer]

Roland triggers are very hard to dial in - even on Roland modules. We tested them in digitalDrummer, along with most of the other brands. My advice: ddrum or DDT.

[logihack]

ok, so ddrum...a guess t drum triggers are exactly like ddrum pro triggers, just cheaper...will i need that Y cable for snare - i hope not

[logihack]

for me, ddrum triggers are sensitive enough...i dont want trigger in the middle of the drum, couse no matter what you do, the drum is more sensitive when is striked directly on trigger...for that reason i like ddrum and drumitfive pads, more than rolands...and if 2box makes pads with triggers on side, i assume this is the way to go...not so long ago i was using ddrum pro trigg. with ddrum4 module and i never had any problems with triggering, exept when three of five triggers where foulty and i found that one hour before concert...luckily, the set was triggered acoustic drum, so we used a mics...
and with jobeky the signal is way to hot when i strike drum in the center....i could do some modifications, but i need working drum all the time...i dont have time for that kind of the experiments...i tried almost everything: acoustic drumset, ddrum4, yamaha dtxtreme3, roland td9, td10, alesis i/o, vst triggering and for me drum it five pads works  best, but they are not made for playing concerts imho
i know i could save some money, but jobeky are allready sold(hope so) and for that money i will buy cheap drums for 500-600eur, 200 for triggers, and 300eur in the pocket
thanks for your help