Hi guys, I am new to this forum but some of you may know me from over on VDrums.com as "rasoo" I've been hanging around on there since 2006.
Anyway recently I decided to change over from my Roland based DIY A-E conversion to a Drumit5 module and 2Box hihat pad.
I take delivery of the module and hats early next week as I write this.
The kit in focus is a modified Ludwig Epic Modular kit. It was originally a blue/black fade with twin 20 x 8" kicks. Toms are 10 x 8, 12 x 8, 14 x 12 and 16 x 12. Snare is 13 x 6.
Here is the donor kit:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/IMG_3734small.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/IMG_3743small.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/IMG_3738small.jpg)
All mounts on a Roland MDS-25 rack (strong!!) I currently have Roland cymbals which I have used before with a 2Box module and they work fine.
I'll be DIY'ing a new 20" ride and a lower hat "cymbal" for the HiHats. Some custom mods for the HiHat clutch are also on the cards.
In its current form the kit sports a "Marble" wrap in a blue/Black colour. That will be going in favour of this new Tangarine Sparkle wrap:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/Newdrumwrap.jpg)
Its ordered and should be coming in from the USA soon.
In the meantime I had (with the help of my mate and fellow member on here "Twisted Mellow" Ian) some custom 2Box decals made from artwork supplied, I got some orange decals made for the front of the kick drum head and some smaller white ones for the bottoms of the custom cymbals I'll be doing. Oh, the cymbal bases will be painted in a lovely bright orange to match the Module.
More on them later....
The front kick decal fitted:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00258.jpg)
Notice the drum is still in its old colour, like I say I don't have the new wrap through yet, but the black hoops will stay.
So, I'll post more as it comes to hand, happy to field questions and comments/suggestions are more than appreciated!!
Rob.
We all want that 2Box logo on the fronthead so much ...
How did you?
Quote from: puttenvr on January 08, 2012, 09:11:49 AM
We all want that 2Box logo on the fronthead so much ...
How did you?
Went to 2Box site and downloaded a .PDF file which had the 2Box logo on it. I then took a screen shot, and cleaned up the logo in MS Paint, I also changed it over to the orange from black.
Once I had the orange logo, it was not near the quality needed to be plotted by the sign maker, so I had the .BMP rendered/vectored to a higher quality (.PDF)
I then sent that file to the sign maker, who then made me 4 x large orange logos (150mm / 6" tall) , and 8 x smaller (75mm / 3" tall) in white. These smaller ones I'll use for my DIY cymbals I am making.
Cost was $51 AUD and $5.60 for postage.
The place I had them made was stickerart.com.au (he may even still have the file... if not I can supply it)
Service was exceptional, next day I had them!!
Orange-ifying the kit - sounds good! And the logo came up really nice :)
Damn these ranga kits... now thinking orange wrap for mine!
Completed the lower hat today.
Sorry I didn't get any pics of me cutting the 1" edge off the donor 14" crash to make it 12" diameter... trust me I did it... by hand with cutters!!! Cleaned the edge up with my angle grinder and going over it lightly.
Nor did I get any pics of me drilling the grommet hole, drilling/grinding the grommet or putting the cymbal into etch primer... but yeah I did that too.
What I DID get pics of follows:
Painted and ready for decal and edging:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00273.jpg)
This is the grommet. I modified a blanking one I had to have the hole large enough for the signal cable to pass through. Did this with a Dremel, the hole in the cymbal was also made larger with the Dremel as well. I'll also mod this to accept the lead for the cable... it will keep it in place as well.
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00275.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00274.jpg)
This is the cymbal inner with rubber edge fitted, the rubber edge used to adorn the rims of the toms. I took the rubber off because I will no longer be using the rim triggers on the toms, the edge is made 1" shorter than the cymbal so that it "stretches" on to give a nice snug fit:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00280.jpg)
Underside of hat bottom, painted, grommet fitted and new decal to go on:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00276.jpg)
And the finished cymbal:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00278.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00279.jpg)
Now to get started on the Ride. That will be during the week!
impressive work on your bottom hats !!
what system are you planning to use for the edge switch of your 20" ride cymbal ?
Not going to worry about the edge really, I don't use the edge on the ride at all. All I want is bow and bell.
Makes life easy come build time.
Welcome on board Rob, you gonna have a lot of fun creating those dsnd's :patbat2box:
Thanks mate! I will indeed.
:D
nice work Rob, Looks cool!
Some more updates!!
Ok, so to start here is the finished HiHat. The original magnet goes inside the bell, placed on a HiHat base felt of about 1/4" thickness. This just raises it a touch to meet the sensor better.
Also, I added another inner ring of rubber to the edge. This actually sits the 2Box hat up about 1/4" as well... perfect seating position for the magnetic "thing" ... sorry I have no idea what to call it... we'll call it the magnetic actuator. Yeah, that sounds tech savvie I reckon.
Some pics:
Underside
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00308.jpg)
And regular view, open
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00304.jpg)
.....closed
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00317.jpg)
Inside of hats... This shows how I overlapped the edging to get the outer edge to raise the upper hat pad. I did this to clear the grey jack box on the underside of the 2Box HH pad.
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00312.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00311.jpg)
Inside of bottom hat assembly:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00310.jpg)
Inner workings assembled:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00307.jpg)
....cont
Now for the progress on the ride.
Donor cymbal painted underside, resting on the 3mm thick smooth rubber sheet that will form the playing surface:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00281.jpg)
Once that was all done I worked out a solution for mounting the Jack housing, and the piezo housing as well. I was going to incorporate the whole thing in one... but I just worked with what I had available to me. I bought a small die cast Aluminium box to house the jack. I also turned up a 2 piece piezo housing that has easy access for any future mods.
So, here is the completed assembled Piezo housing, before fitment to the cymbal.
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00286.jpg)
Its underside (which I didn't photgraph unfortunately..) is profile shaped to match the inner bell profile of the cymbal. I did this to make it easier to attach the housing to the cymbal. As it will be pop riveted, if it were flat, the rivets would not reach though and grab... also it would make it prone to damage with a poor fit.
Here is the housing dry fitted to the cymbal, for matching and drilling:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00284.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00285.jpg)
The inside of the housing, has a cut out for the piezo to mount directly the the metal cymbal, on a double thickness disc of double sided tape.
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00290.jpg)
Riveting the assembly to the cymbal.
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00287.jpg)
And how the piezo will mount:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00292.jpg)
This pic shows Aluminium box used to house the jack, and where it will locate:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00294.jpg)
....cont
Now, you'll notice the small hole under the jack, this is where the piezo wires come through from the piezo housing, I ground a small valley to accomodate the wires so they would not get crushed by the top plate when fitted.
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00295.jpg)
This is a close up of it:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00298.jpg)
Ready for soldering:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00296.jpg)
And soldered:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00301.jpg)
And finally the completed assembly, all protected and no stray wires or risk of piezo damage. Sturdy too.... a must I say.
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00299.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00300.jpg)
I couldn't help myself! I had to sit it in the kit to see how much better it will be when done!
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00302.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00309.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00303.jpg)
So, all I have left to do is fit the top rubber sheet, edge it with a little cutting device I devised, and fit the rubber outer edge.
Oh.. I also made up a little mount for the module too... took all of 10 minutes!
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00318.jpg)
Nice work Rob I will post some photo's soon of my upgraded 2box kit. :rock:
Ride is finished. Triggers beautifully!!
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00325.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00326.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00324.jpg)
I also added a remote HiHat stand, so I could get some more angle on the hats, as the edge can easily be worn out with these items... I think I am going to do something about that soon. Also added the 2Box 14" cymbals into the kit.
The wraps should arrive this week from the USA, so I'll get stuck into them soon.
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00329.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/DSC00331.jpg)
I am thinking of throwing a couple of splitters on, so I can get a splash, the China, a X-Stick and a cowbell. The unused ride "edge" input I'll use for the China, while I'll split the toms to get the rest.
X Roland guy here too! Looks awesome Rob, love your DIY 2box cymbals!
Kit re-colour is finished. Finished off a few other things too...
Still got some things in the works...
Here are some pics:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/DSC00368.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/DSC00369.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/DSC00374.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/DSC00371.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/DSC00375.jpg)
nice work!
Lovely looking kit, great work.
fantastic
:animal: :animal: :animal:
Looks really good! Is that a Gibraltar rack you use?
Nah mate its a Roland MDS-25 (Top of the line rack) that Roland uses on their flagship models. It has all the cables in a clear finish that are fitted into the rack. Helps keep cables manageable, and its very strong too. The Roland Hardware, so I found out last night, is actually built by Mapex.
Kit looks fantastic. I feared it would turn out too orange, but it came up a treat. I bet it looks even better in the flesh.
Quote from: ROB219 on February 05, 2012, 09:38:45 PM
The Roland Hardware, so I found out last night, is actually built by Mapex.
Actually, I believe Roland sources its hardware from DW.
Mapex B75 cymbal arm:
(http://static.music123.com/derivates/19/001/248/955/DV020_Jpg_Jumbo_473403.jpg)
Roland MDY-12 cymbal arm:
(http://rockshop.de/webbildergrossxxl/500/1072452_01.jpg)
If those 2 aren't the same Allan I'll eat my hat.
Err... actually, no, there are subtle differences (see the nuts, the rubber grommet, etc). I'm only going by what I was told at the DW stand at NAMM. I'm not saying Roland never sourced from Mapex - rather that DW is the current source.
They looks quiet the same but you can find quiet identical design with other brand.
Happy hat eating ;D
Fantastic job for the kit, you gave orange color justice !
Oh and BTW, did you get your previous wrap from Sic Skinz ? It looks that way.
Nah I won't be eating my hat... they're the same... too similar not to be, and with the big brands not wanting to copy each other (patent laws and such) it would seem stupid of DW to copy Mapex, or vice versa. It has to be a Mapex item, albeit slightly different to accomodate the Roland way of life. I stand by my statement. Just because a few little things are different doesn't mean it is.
Sure DW may be the CURRENT supplier of the rack clamps and tubing... but I highly doubt they're copying the Mapex design for the cymbal arms.
But I've been told I am wrong by many others before... when in fact I am right.
So we'll leave that at that. Its not a major drama anyway, I'll be buying the Mapex arms in future at 75% of the cost of the SAME Roland item.
Quote from: ROB219 on February 06, 2012, 05:27:14 AM
Mapex B75 cymbal arm:
(http://static.music123.com/derivates/19/001/248/955/DV020_Jpg_Jumbo_473403.jpg)
can i ask something? (please dont laugh at me). what is this arm used for? one cymbal or more? i ask because i havent seen such a plastic thing on tom of an arm. if it is for 2 cymbals, does it work like a stacker? and how are the cymbals attached on it? i need 4 stackers to add 2 splashes and 2 bells in my set (ok it is not my first priority, i am happy with my 2 crashed and my china in my acoustic set, but id like to know if this thingy is helpful for such things and if it is better than a stacker
Only useful to you if you're using an acoustic cymbal. It will come off for me to use with E cymbals. They just slide off, leaving the inner to attach whatever type of mount you like really, the Roland one pictured is what the Mapex arm will look like with the cymbal rubbers removed.
This particular series uses rubber instead of felt, I've owned them in the past and they're not bad, but in no way really useful for an electronic cymbal.
Takes all of... 5 seconds... to remove it....
Yes they are just the standard acoustic cymbal holders. The Cymbal fits between the two half spheres. I have a Mapex acoustic set, exactly the same. They are very tidy.
yes i am talking about acoustic cymbals. i dont have a full acoustic set, but i have 13awesome acoustic cymbals to use with my band and an amazing snare. along with my eliminators 2002b its all i need i wont bother buying a kickand toms right now.... so it is for one cymbal. so it wont do for me. after all i dont put the upper felt on my crashes. cause i need them to move freely to absorb less energy
rob hi
i have some questions
the rubber u used to cover your acoustic cymbal, where did you get it from?
i want to do something similar, thats why i ask this.
also the piezo and the jack you solded the piezo into, and its box, can you tell me their name? how i can search them in ebay? what name do you use?
ok the piezo is "piezo" but the jack that you sold with the piezo, what is it called?
and a more technical one
i do not want to start drilling etc.you think from your experience that if i aply a little foam underneath the cymbal and attach the piezo under it, will this do the job? thank you
ps. does it matter, which piezo wire (from the 2) i solder, in which of the solder places od the jack?
Ok, the rubber is just 3mm (1/8") thick rubber sheet. Where you would buy it locally I don't know but here in Australia is is readily available at hardware stores and rubber suppliers. You should be able to get it off ebay, but be warned it has a lot of mass to it, and hence its heavy so shipping cost could become a factor.
I don't know where you live, but I would try a local harware first. It is glued to the cymbal top surface using a contact adhesive. The same stuff that used to glue laminate sheets to benchtops in kitchens.
You will need to rough up the surface of both the cymbal AND the underside of the rubber sheet BEFORE applying any glue... and I mean ROUGH it up!!! The rougher the better as this creates a greater surface area for the glue and you get a better result.
Use a 36 to 80 grit sandpaper on an electric sander to make the job fast. Or, if you are careful use an angle grinder like I did to mark as much of the cymbal surface as possible. I didn't care as I was never going to use it as an acoustic cymbal ever again. If you go this way... just be gentle with it and take your time to get as much of the cymbal surface as possible.
Regarding the electronics, the "jack" is exactly that.... a jack. Search for a 1/4" or 6.5mm female jack socket.
The box I used is an extruded aluminium project box... sometimes called "jiffy" boxes. PVC is also ok to use but a bit trickier to work with, as it can split easily when drilling if you're not careful.
You "could" just attach the whole lot under an acoustic cymbal using GOOD quality double side tape (DST)
3M is probably some the best going... get the extra heavy duty stuff as is sticks a lot better. Speaking of which.. be sure to clean the surface of the cymbal with thinners or a wax & grease remover before attaching any DST to it... the smallest amount of dirt film will mean adhesion failure.
I solder the ceramic part (centre) of the piezo to the "tip" of the jack socket, and the outer brass part goes to the sleeve. NO ring! MONO plugs only when using a single piezo.
mate you are awesome. and that is very very informative and helpful
ok i will either make an acoustic cymbal this way (i will try and get very very cheap, damaged splashes), or iwill buy (and my buddy will fetch em) pintech cymbals that have no electronics on them , andtransform them
http://www.hopedrums.com/xt_cymbals.htm
the cost 12 dollars. i am guessing that the acoustic cymbal plus the rubber sheet might cost more. ill search and decide
while you answered me, i came across this site
http://mikemx3000.tripod.com/id10.html
this guy used 3 piezos, instead of one, all parallel together. for better sensitivity. you think this is necessary? if one piezo will do, i will stick with it
the only thing i didnt understand is you last sentence (sorry for my english, i am greek)
. NO ring! MONO plugs only when using a single piezo.
what do you mean? you mean that i have to buy a mono piezo? are there stereo piezos?
(i want a single zone cymbal btw, no 2zone or 3zone. a choke function for my china would be nice, but i dont know if it will work, cause the output i will use will be from a splitted tom)...
piezos have 2 wires right?
the jack has 3 places so i am avoiding one of the three? i mixed it up a bit. all piezos are thesame? i dont mind to pay a bit more of the piezo will be better.
thank you for everything.
ps. is the orange colour you used, some splecial paint? a brush and some paint will also do it for me, or do i need to spray it?
ps2. thanx for everything
ps3. how did you manage to put the rubber on the edge of the cymbal, and make it look good? it seems awesome, and it must be very difficult...
actually the metric equivalent of a 1/4" jack is 6.25mm.
jack plugs & sockets come in two main varieties, mono jacks have only a tip & sleeve, and are commonly referred to as TS jacks. these are generally used to carry a one signal and a ground, e.g.:
(http://www.swamp.net.au/images/productimages/Large/NP2X.jpg)
the other main variety of jack are TRS jacks (tip, ring, and sleeve). these have 3 separate connections and are used for stereo connections, balanced connections, and for Y-cables for mixing desk insert points. e.g.:
(http://www.swamp.net.au/images/productimages/Large/NP3X.jpg)
the piezos are 'mono' in that they have only a single signal with a ground, so you only need a TS jack for those. you can use a TRS jack by not connecting the ring contact, however you need to be careful to do it right otherwise it won't work. also, TRS jacks are more expensive, and trickier to solder right.
note that if you are making your own Y-cables then you will need a TRS jack at the module end, so that the two separate trigger inputs merge onto the same input on the module...
that clarifies everything thank you so much
i wont solder the cables i will buy them . thank you
I posted up a demo on Youtube about the kit and some playing to demo the sounds. Skip to around 10 minutes in the hear the kit and see how it goes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdkyhPpDT5g
Great video! these kind of vids are always interesting.... that Tama Superstar is nice too 8)
Hey guys... been a while since I posted anything in this thread. I've been doing things here and there.
A few changes I have made to the kit:
NO 2Box cymbals or HiHat on the module now. Crashes are all Yamaha, the HiHat is a Yamaha PCY135 as well, which rests on a custom made clutch designed to utilise the Yamaha rotation stopper.
The HiHat control module now lives as part of a DW5500 HiHat stand.
The module is now mainly black. :)
Anything that was ornage on the kit is now black.
A few pics:
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/IMG_4134.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/IMG_4142.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/IMG_4147.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/IMG_4165.jpg)
(http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h86/rasoo/Drums%20and%20gear/IMG_4169.jpg)
Wow the 2Box module in black is sleek !
Using a PCY-135 as a Hi hat is something I wanted to do as well and i was wondering how to place the anti rotation device on a regular Hi hat clutch. Now is the answer.
Why did you swap the 2Box Hi hat for a PCY-135 ? Is it for reliability ? Triggering ?
Thanks for sharing.
A stock HH clutch may or may not work... they are a bit thinner than this one I custom machined.
It is thicker in diameter to allow foir the large hole that Yamaha put in the PCY135/155.
But give it a go with one and see what you think. You'll have to drill out the rotation stopper to the right size though.
I swapped out the stock HH for all of the things you mentioned. Its just plain better in every way.