How many samples for DSNDs

[digitalDrummer]

There hasn't been much discussion about the number of layers people are using when they brew DSNDs. I note the DSoundTool only allows 99, but in retrospect, that seems quite generous. Many VSTs use far less samples per articulation.
I have done a few 80-plus layers for snares (probably more layers than the original sample) and a few 66-layer toms and cymbals, but I'm noticing that the files are getting quite big 300Mb, so I'm considering easing back.
Any thoughts?

[BURNIN AMBITION]

hi there alan
i will answer your question with another question.

the other day i read about roland kits having machine gunning. things like pd-125 etc (you remember, the snare i want to get). but then i thought, that this is an excellent snare, it cant be its fault for machinegunning.
and it came to me. its rolands fault. because they use far less layers than 2box

so if machinegunning effect can be avoided by having many dynamic layers in a sample, then why is it bad to have m,any layers in a sample? even if the size is big?
i mean most 2box users, have now 32gb sd cards(me included). and we most feel like wed rather have 30 new samples of 300 mbyte each, than have 300 new samples of 30 mbyte each. we need to have our samples close to the real thing. thats why we adore 2box brain.
now, i dont know if 100 mbyte samples would be fine for our needs here (perhaps human eye cant understand the difference after some specific number of layers, as the differences of each layer would be little) but bigger size never hurt anyone

once again thank ypu for your contribution to the forum.

and i hope you would be kind enough to share some samples!!!!

btw id kill for a mapex black panther sledgehammer snare (its my acoustic snare and it is the best snare in the world. really) and for some masterwork pera cymbals, or istanbul mehmet radiant cymbals. amazing stuff. i have 13 masterwork pera cymbals and they are better than anysabian and zildjian i have ever heard

[digitalDrummer]

and i hope you would be kind enough to share some samples!!!!

HI BA. We're getting onto dangerous ground here. None of us wants to violate our licences from Toontrack or FXpansion, so I doubt you'll see any sample sharing here.
Of course, if someone out there has recording facilities and is able to provide royalty-free samples, it's a different matter.
Yes, I know it's frustrating that many of us are re-inventing the wheel, churning out DSNDs from the same original samples, but it would be even more frustrating if we couldn't do it all!

[BURNIN AMBITION]

ok thanx for the answer alan. perhaps i should give it another try and try to make my own samples. even though last time i sucked at it...
to cut a long story short, the best way till know is the way described in the pdf, someone uploaded earlier in this thread? from bfd? thanx

[digitalDrummer]

I had some teething problems, but the revised instructions for BFD are spot-on if you follow them step by step, and with the "export audio" option, it's much quicker as well.
Just be aware that you need to rename each sample after you produce it as BFD continues to export a file with the same name, so you'll over-write your samples with newer ones.

[Slap the drummer]

Many of the stock 2box sounds have only 25 to 30 layers, and that can work fine (imo).
Certainly 40 to 50 will give a very playable file.

Personally I like 99 layers - but, this is with a velocity spread all the way down from 0db
to -40/-50db.  Also, I turn the module's variation feature OFF.  This way my own (sloppy)
playing gives me all the variation I need.

That's for toms and snares.  As Jman pointed out somewhere, something like a crash just
doesn't need anything like 99 hits!

And then again, for a kick drum I like a more compressed range of velocities - this is after
nearly blowing my head off a couple of times when I really stomped down on it... and the
kick drum/dsnd responded! 

[BURNIN AMBITION]

thanx to all, i think this will be my  summer project!!
a stupid question follows but i ask it so that when i start making dsnds i wont have to wait.
i dont need anything else apart from my pc and bfd2 right? i mean no cables to connect 2box with pc are required. cause last time i tried to connect 2box to pc with midi cable, i failed dramatically. cheers

[Slap the drummer]

Hi BA - yep, just BFD as a standalone on your PC.  And the DSoundTool software from Louis
installed as well - to convert the wav files to the right format.

I like to have some WAV file editing program as well.  Even if you don't edit anything it can be
very useful to open the exported files to see exactly what you've got.

Audacity is free and should do the job.

[BURNIN AMBITION]

for wav editing i use adobe audition sibce the beginning of time. it is an amazing program. check it out

if i remember well, dsoundtool wasnt free, right? nevertheless i could buy it i guess...

one last question. can someone give me the full name of bfd2 and what other libraries or expansion of it i could buy? so that i have a full library and choose to make my favorite samples from it?

finally, to answer alan questions, can someone confirm what is the optimal number of layers for
a tom
a snare
a floor tom
crashes
rides
hi hat
china
splash
kick

and waht is the minimum amount of layers, one must use to avoid machinegunning? thanx to all

off to go to the other bfd samples making thread to know all the problems you people faced, to avoid them