Author Topic: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?  (Read 1999 times)

Coda

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Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« on: April 12, 2017, 04:55:58 AM »
I have noticed a few stores discounting the Gen16 cymbal sets. It's making me wonder if they've announced a replacement product or something. Does anyone have any 'inside info'?
I wanted to buy just a DCP and a pair of 14" hats, but the individual pieces would cost me a heck of lot more than a new 13"/18" set (about 550 UKP). I have found the 13/16/18 for 750 UKP and the 14/16/20 set for 840 UKP inc free shipping anywhere within the EU.
But - is it the wrong time to be splashing out on these (pun intended :P)

edtc

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2017, 10:36:03 AM »
Perhaps they have sold so many L80 that they are able to lower the price ... ;) 



digitalDrummer

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2017, 01:39:31 AM »
Probably old stock. Not aware of any moves to stop Gen16 or introduce anything that will "replace" the current rage.
Remember too that Zildjian is now facing competition from cheap Chinese knock-off 'silent' cymbals.
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edtc

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2017, 03:14:40 AM »
Go for the 13/18 kit ... HH and ride are more playable on real cymbals, and crashs sounds better with E-cymbals ... I dont like the L80/gen16 crash sound ,  E-cymbals have enough playability IMO ...

Coda

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2017, 04:26:16 AM »
Go for the 13/18 kit ... HH and ride are more playable on real cymbals, and crashs sounds better with E-cymbals ... I dont like the L80/gen16 crash sound ,  E-cymbals have enough playability IMO ...
This is what I was thinking, the major win for me would be the hi-hat.
I have heard conflicting opinions about the Gen16 stuff, that the cymbals are not very good sounding, and it's putting me off from making the switch. I don't know if it's that they really are bad or just that most people don't have the patience to properly set them up. I'm considering getting the 14/16/20 set just to get the larger hats, maybe they would be easier to get a good sound from...

Thanks guys.

AndyMo

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2017, 09:58:06 AM »
From what I've heard on demos, etc., you can get a very usable sound from the hats. The 13 hats and 14 hats sound good to me.

The crashes seem the weakest link but some demos appear to 'get round this' with DCP processing and carefully positioning them (deep) in the mix. There are various sizes available and the splash sounds quite interesting to me.

I think the ride can be OK with the right DCP settings but from the demos I've seen the bell is weak.

These videos might be of interest:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uivo9SS6NEE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zrOrmpl-JY

If you do give them a try, I'd like to hear your thoughts.

Cheers,
Andy
Thanks!

Coda

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2017, 03:48:21 AM »
Thanks for the youtube links Andymo, I have watched those.
I hear that the crashes and the bell on the ride are the weakest links. The bell is easy to get around, because I can keep my existing 3z DIY ride which works pretty well. Crashes? well, for me I'd just like a chokeable crash that I can also swell or play with mallets if necessary. The fact that they sound a bit thin I don't think is an issue in a live setting.
For most people I think they basically open up more sonic possibilities, the downside for me is that I'd have to learn to play real hats again  :-X

AndyMo

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2017, 08:45:16 AM »
You're welcome Coda. It would be very interesting to hear how you get on if you purchase a set. As you say, I think there are a lot of possibilities.

Currently, I switch between my ekit (function band) and a tiny acoustic set up (4 piece acoustic band). With the acoustic set, I am using my trusty old 14" Sabian Fusion hats - and it is a stark reminder of why I need to find a decent hihat solution for my ekit : )
Thanks!

Murgen

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2017, 01:32:23 PM »
Heya Coda,

You know I practice with GEN16's.

Quote
GEN16
Later in 2012 I purchased a GEN16 pack and in 2013 replaced the original cymbals by the new buffed GEN16 cymbals. Since this is a review on how hardware keeps up over the years the GEN16 is included. Module, cabling, DSP-pickups and lights still work well. I have a DSP-pickup on both 14-inch hats, on 2 18-inch crashes and 1 on the 20-inch ride. Earlier this year I decided to go back to Julia Dee’s (developer) original software. It enables me to tweak and tune a lot more than the toy-software Zildjian allows me to do. Do I like the sounds? Well, mixed feelings, I do not mind practicing with the GEN16 sounds but probably will start using triggers when the module breaks down.

I'm quite happy with the hats, the 2 18-inch crashes (silver and buffed) and the ride for practice. I cannot get used to the new Zildjian software because it seems very limited (to 1 hat, 1 16-inch crash, 1 18-inch crash, ride and china and I was not able to download the right files into the right slots to accommodate 2 hats, 2 18-inch and the ride). However, Julia Dee's software works and is more flexible.   

I just made an unprepared recording. I was in my drum-cabin, turned the Mac to my kit and clicked record. I hate improvising or just doing something before camera but I tried to fiddle around a bit. What you hear is the output from the A&H mixer into Apple Quicktime. Inputs on mixer are 2Box and GEN16 module.

I also hit one of the 2Box cymbals in this little demo ... well ... I know what sounds better :)

https://youtu.be/wdXOFBEOi10
« Last Edit: April 19, 2017, 02:39:06 PM by Murgen »
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Jim Marshall, Lord of Loud, inventor of the Marshall amps was a drummer too ...

Coda

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2017, 04:14:20 PM »
Yeah, to be honest, I am not impressed by those sounds. It's like having cymbals with 100's of rivets in them, but wait! no rivets...
I think I'm gonna reconsider where I should better spend close to €1.000 ...

Maybe some real hats, a good condenser mic, and a boom?   :o

Murgen

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2017, 04:18:26 PM »
Yeah, to be honest, I am not impressed by those sounds. It's like having cymbals with 100's of rivets in them, but wait! no rivets...
I think I'm gonna reconsider where I should better spend close to €1.000 ...

Maybe some real hats, a good condenser mic, and a boom?   :o

My acoustic kit has Paiste Giant Beats. I know the difference. ;) GEN16 works for practice and actually sound slightly better via headphones but basically, this is what you get.

I hope I helped you. Consider the cymbals with Jman's triggers.
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Coda

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2017, 04:37:57 PM »
I already use acoustic cymbals with triggers. They sounds great (BFD3), the playability... ok but not so great. That's why I got turned onto the Gen16s.
One thing I know for sure though, I am wearing the same apple watch + blue strap :)

AndyMo

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2017, 05:20:18 PM »
Coda - that is my current plan, unless or until I can find a decent hihat solution... I am going to try my Sabian hats and use my Rode instrument mic (that I use with my Cajon/acoustic set up) and see how it blends with my 2Box set up.

I run my 2Box module through a Yamaha powered PA speaker (and out to the PA when possible) and am currently looking for a suitable mixer. I have seen some good Yamaha mixers that support phantom power mic inputs and plenty of line inputs if I want separate outs from my module. They newer modules also have USB multi-track out, which could be handy for recording I expect.

My biggest concern is I am lugging yet more gear to gigs! :)
Thanks!

Coda

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2017, 05:59:41 PM »
My biggest concern is I am lugging yet more gear to gigs! :)
Yeah this consideration is quite often overlooked! Especially when GAS sets in.
I have already been thinking what to do to change my lugging requirements, and think I've got it covered. More or less.

edtc

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Re: Zildjian Gen16 pricing?
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2017, 11:10:52 PM »
try with some L80 and cheap condenser mics ... even a line level camera mic direct in module's line in would be enough for practicing ...

a cheaper alternative , especially if you end with converting them to E-cymbals ...
I bought a 13 14 18 set , sold the crash ... HH+ride costed me around 170€ this way ...