Future of 2box

[hemiboy]

Is 2 box , just having a quality product, a good enough reason to survive as a company? We have all noticed and commented that there is next to no real push or fanfare that one would think would be going on to make this product explode in the US market. Are we, or should  I say, I, looking for a marching band parade that isn't necessary? What do you guys think?  Are there big plans  for 2 box in the US or do you think it fizzles out? I personally feel that it will be bought out shortly.

[Murgen]

My personal opinion: 2Box is better in technology then marketing (orange color is a good example). The boys seem to be technology driven and that make them sell units to the drummers that are looking for the best sounds. So they sell units to you and to me because we know and we picked up the buzz. The pricing of the unit should make it possible to plug into the mainstream of drummers that buy Roland and Yamaha because they do not know about 2Box. And that is where a proper marketing operation should kick in. And that is what is missing at the moment. 2Box move to work with Hoshi should have been more beneficial then it is now. I also think that the Roland Patents in the US is still a showstopper. It is easier to sell with mesh then rubber. 

[fulrmr]

Hmm...I think it just takes more time for the culmination of all these factors to come together in reality for a successful new product line than most of us realize or have the patience to endure the process. My "speculation" (as is any conversation of this nature) would be that 2Box is very small....yes ....technologically savvy...yes..... stupid...umm no. I'd say cunning enough, if given time,  to slide in under the radar enough to eventually knock the legs out from under the "Big Boys" before they see it coming, because they don't see them as threat. These boys are not daft when it come to business or the needs of the demographic they target and IMHO are "easing" into the process with small steps, so as not to get so far over their heads that it all come crashing down at once(as  a lot of companies over the years have done). Most small businesses don't even show a profit before 5 years much less secure a nationally known distribution contract.  Frankly we should be concentrating on(and shouting it to the masses) all the things we think they are doing right rather than speculating about all the things we think are a hindrance, especially since we are not privy to the business model plan they have in mind. As for the US introduction...I think we should give them a year or so before we continually predict their ultimate demise. Just my 2 cents.

[thecompetition]

Well, it's going to be a rough ride considering the competition...

http://youtu.be/t1J9Q-oUDZ8

Happy easter.

[hemiboy]

Yeah Dan, I don't count them out yet, and I believe that there is a ton of business savvy besides besides the obvious tech  savvy I am really curious what you guys think is in the wings. There could be a master plan behind closed doors that would ultimately not only allow 2 box to survive, but to take the lead! I don't want to be the prophet of gloom and doom and I sincerely hope they flourish. But,no matter how  much well thought out planning is going on behind those closed doors , there has to be some form of action taken, sooner or later for anything to change. But I have to admit, I don't really think 2Box is too concerned with my judgement of when and how all this should take place, lol... Didn't mean to bash 2 box just for sport, just wanted to hear what others think is going on with the lack of promotion of an excellent product, that's all.  I try to sing the praises of 2 box whenever anybody here or on the many other forums  ask for a good module, but I save all the bashing for you guys!

[Dänoh]

Very inspiring thread, Gentlemen!


The 'push' or 'buzz' I feel will come from either of two sides: Hoshino, or Us, the community! Ideally, the buzz will come from both sides simultaneously! ... a genuine 'encirclement attack.' 

I don't think the 'Big Boys' never saw it coming! Else I couldn't plausibly justify the sheer existence of Roland's TM2! (...other than it being simply a product for 'water testing').




Murgen has a good point about pricing:
TD15 - 2box is squarely aiming at future TD15 customers. Maybe they'll dig into Roland's future TD15 sales as well. Honest, I would have to search for reasons to go with a TD15 to begin with, given the present market situation.

TD30 - Current TD30 owners will be in denial, I guess... 
I mean, a colored module that is sounding more natural than 'SuperNatural'...?
At (not even) half the price...?
EVIL!

...'pure Evil' I tell 'ya ...'Pure Evil' in module-form! 




As Daniel said it, the people behind 2box are not daft! ...they better not be.
After all, they have years of experience under their belt within the 'realm' of Clavia/DDrum!

[hemiboy]

Guys , am I missing something here? .Because 2 box is in the same price point as a Td 15 and in my opinion blows the sounds of the td 30 away, ( I had one)  why aren't they being displayed, promoted, and advertised by their dealer network? I backed off the other day because I don't want to have negative comments about it, but I am over it. I also respect the opinions of those that felt I was kinda bashing them. I can and do shout the praises of 2 box and I showed my support by buying one. It is not my job to promote them or advertise them, unless they start paying me! Nobody is saying that the originators aren't bright and innovative. But if you want to compete, put your gloves on and get in the ring! If Floyd Mayweather was losing, nobody would be coddling him and his promotors and keep talking about what their  plans might be in the back room.What is the plan in the ring?  Either you are hitting or you are getting hit! Because it is priced so reasonably and it's a super product,  show it to the world . This product should be almost selling itself and it's not! Why, because nobody knows about it. Wake up 2 box, this is not the Wizard of Oz. Come  out from behind the curtain. Put on your gloves and start punching! See those guys over there? Yeah, that's Floyd Roland and Manny Yamaha and they want to knock your head off! There I said it and I'm glad! There is negativity and there is reality!

[Dänoh]

Don't underestimate the word of mouth!

The orange headlines in the new Tama Cocktail-Jam ads is a promising start. I could see this going somewhere...   The idea of a 2box-based A2E kit that is compact and doesn't take up much space is a very delicious and exciting one!

I don't know how 'tight' their dealer network is at present, but I know there have been tremendous support from guys like Scott from Cymbalism, Davey from Diamond-Drums, or Steven from Electronic Drum Center.

And at NAMM 2box struck a deal with other big dealers (such as Guitar Center), so those who want 2box sooner or later will get 2box! ...no matter if there are big, flashy advertisements in the background or not.

I would rather like to NOT co-finance Roland's big, bold marketing-machinery department....   

[hemiboy]

Danoh, I think we are both basically saying the same thing, but as far as guys like Cymbalisism. And e drum center supporting 2 box and going out of there way to support the company and customers, many of them forum members here and on v drum, there is no doubt. I couldn't agree more. I am talking about 2 box supporting THEM! Supporting them  by filling their showrooms with banners like ( 2 Box Is Here! ) Have kits and modules in  brick and mortar showrooms at RMC Audio,  Guitar center, Sam Ash, etc...And train employees as to  what 2 box is, where it's from, and how it differs from Roland, Yammie and everybody else. In other words,  give it a fair and formal introduction to the USA. If the farmer wants to marry off his daughter, he doesn't lock her in her room, he takes her out for all to see, right . Anyway,  we all want  2box to make it. I am going to save  my breath. This is marketing 101, not rocket science. I will survive no matter what they do! If this is their marketing plan that constructed behind closed doors, IMHO, they better go back behind closed doors or they will go the way Yugo went, lol!

[Dänoh]

Oh, it's this way around, Okay! 
Yes, I agree: The dealers can be supportive all they want - if they don't take delivery, have 2box product to sell, and can stock up on 'the good stuff', the whole endeavour is kinda askew... backwards ....pointless ...really missing the mark.

THen again,  I'm positive that currently, at the moment at least the 'top dogs' (mentioned above) haven't any issues with stock! It seems it is more the 'braching out', that is the hard part. In other countries, like Canada for example.

If 'mccrackins' experience is anything to go by, guys like 'Long-McQuade' really have stock problems now, it seems. I mean, come on, the poor guy waited like 8 months, only to finally have to cancel his order (there is something VERY wrong, here!) and heading straight to Cymbalism! (there is something GOOD, here!) From 'Long-McQuade's point-of-view, either they got runned over with inquiries, or Hoshino simply couldn't get the modules to them. Who knows?


Who exactly should give the poor staff this kind of education regarding 2box, anyway? Does 2box itself have marketing- or sales-representatives?

(who the heck is Yugo, by the way?)

[hemiboy]

Yugo was a car company that didn't make it in the day when wheels were square when I was a kid! I forgot to factor in how old I am compared to most of you guys when I posted that! Anyway had some extra time last week so I got to play a lot and enjoy my 2 box.Looking forward to Addictive drums 2 release as well next month. Let's see what happens. Yeah, poor mckrackins  was the record holder in Canada at nine plus months waiting . I gotta be in the running  in the US at the 8 plus months , but we are both long past that and enjoying out 2 box now. Go 2 box !!!

[Murgen]

Yugo did not make it but Skoda did! By working together with Volkswagen.

[fulrmr]

hehehe...I remember the Yugo.

Only time will tell the tale. IMHO...it's all about money...time and patience. Slow methodical advancements in a market that's already saturated with "established old blood". 2Box doesn't have the expendable capital at the moment to "out bling" the present competitors...even with the spectacular product they now have. So...getting consistent distribution in place, before hand, and word of mouth established  (satisfied true user testimony) is key to solidify any spectacular advertising campaign at the moment. I've seen too many new companies and new products drive up the hype to the "9's" only to become vaporware or at the very most..an extreme disappointment because they couldn't back it up. 2Box is well on the way to being able to back up every statement they have put out related to the supremacy of their product. All we can do at the moment is keep putting out our positive experiences until the time comes when "real" push begins after they have "dug in" and break out the pyrotechnics and the light show begins.

[Dänoh]

(...) so as not to get so far over their heads that it all come crashing down at once(as  a lot of companies over the years have done).

I've seen too many new companies and new products drive up the hype to the "9's" only to become vaporware or at the very most..an extreme disappointment

I can't see inside your head ()  so what companies are on your mind?
Any particular names? (...that I've never heard before?)

[hemiboy]

Yeah Dan and Danoh , I guess they have to proceed slowly, with today's available capital only, not  Let's see what happens going into a mass of borrowed funds because what that is called , even if is not formally mentioned, taking on partners. I have to admit  that the little bit that I have experienced with advertising, is that it is super expensive!  I also am going to take this opportunity to resign as Director Of Operations for the 2 Box Company. I have been going thru some rough stuff in my personal life  and a lot of anger has been coming out all over.  I went thru  my recent posts, and I realized that I am out of my f-----g mind. Sorry for the rants guys. Instead of looking at the glasses as half full instead of half empty, I have been smashing all the glasses, yours, mine, everybody's! Trying to fasten myself securely back  to reality today, looking for a strong enough chain, and a muzzle to go with it. Hey Dan, you remember the Yugo, good man!